Fuck Israel!

[Prolescum]

Rrrright, your double standards are showing again. Isn't it strange that you have manifested no objection whatsoever to some of the other statements made in this thread such as "Israel is a crazy country. Fuck them"?

It isn't a double standard; Israel can fuck off. They (as a country) deserve as little respect as they give. Don't care for international laws or the views of the international community? Fine, why should the international community give a fuck about you?

Honestly, I'm not surprised Israel ignores those UN resolutions, when the UN's Human Rights Council is continually tainted by countries that don't know the meaning of human rights

We're not talking about the UNHRC; Israel ignores both the General Assembly and Security Council. If you are under the impression that they are the same thing, well, that's hilarious.

As a member state, Israel is bound under Article 25 of the United Nations Charter to agree, accept and carry out the decisions of the Security Council, but they don't.

http://www.un.org/en/documents/charter/chapter5.shtml

The UN is a joke these days

The resolutions go all the way back to Israel's genesis. That "argument" is weak sauce.

Apartheid... Do you know what that is?

Yes, I'm old enough to remember it.

It's basically a policy of segregation and discrimination as practiced in South Africa decades ago. Blacks didn't have the same rights, interracial marriage was banned, there were zones restricted based on race, heck even restrooms were separate for blacks and whites.

Although I concede the analogy isn't perfect, it's really not too far off.

Here's the views of someone with some direct experience:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2002/apr/29/comment

Nothing of this sort exists in Israel.

Yep, nothing. Nothing at all of that sort exists in Israel. Nada. Zip. Oh wait...

http://elyon1.court.gov.il/heb/veadot/or/inside_index.htm

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0309/S00048.htm

20% of the population is Arab and they have equal rights and this is not just theory, they can even hold important positions such as judge http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Karra - It was an Arab judge among 3 judges that convicted a former Israeli president (Moshe Katsav) of rape. Hmmm, nobody seemed bothered right?

Ooh, you found an instance of an Arab judge! Well done you! Read the Or commission's report (the link above). It took three years and categorically disputes your assertion, so it's only right that you familiarise yourself with it.

Not that I expect you to take it into consideration...

Funny that you mentioned the wall around Israel as something bad.

Ask a German if building a wall is bad.

Is the Mexican border an "apartheid" or "oppression" or whatever you want to call it?

Risible comparison.

No, it's just a border and it was meant to keep suicidal fuckers out and other terrorists.

The Mexican border was meant to keep out suicidal fuckers and other terrorists? Please, Dogma's second coming, tell us the tale of how the Mexican border was put in place to keep suicidal fuckers and other terrorists out. Remember, it's been there for quite some time.

How about the real apartheid in Muslim countries, where Palestinians are not given the same treatment as other immigrants or refugees (they can't become citizens, their children can't become citizens, they can't work in many professions, they don't have healthcare etc.) because those countries want to artificially maintain their "Palestinian identity", thereby fueling the conflict for future generations to come?

This thread is about Israel. Feel free to start a thread about the fuckery of Lebanon.

Look dude, this conflict exists because in 1948, the Arabs didn't accept the partitioning of the land and went to war.

Actually, it's far more complex than that. I don't have the time to write an essay about it, but it will suffice to say that neither side accepted the other.

I don't see how there can be peace with the likes of Hamas and Fatah in power. Israel lays down its weapons and these fuckers will only grow stronger and continue their terrorist and warmongering activities.

The exact reverse can be stated as fact too; of the many ceasefires, both sides have reignited hostilities.

As Joe has already said, Israel is supposed to be a modern, secular, democratic nation, but they repeatedly ignore international laws and UN security council rulings, continually reinforce the hatred against them, have a second-class citizenry, and disregard almost all criticism.

 

[Visaki]

Oh please, are you implying the Jews who founded 1948 Israel were just converts with no link to ancient Israelis?

Look I'm sure some are converts, but for the most part, these are ethnic Jews. (Some of them could be atheists for example, yet still count as ethnic Jews.) Their ancestors were forced out of their homeland about 1900 years before, so they returned. (Then again some Jews never even left.)

As for "other people", you do realize the Arabs also got a state of their own in the region? Modern Israel is not as big as ancient Israel. Yet the Arab leaders didn't accept the borders and went to war in league with the other neighboring states.

No, I'm not one of those people who thinks most modern Israeli jews are converts from south Russia, or something like that. I actually think that the jews were one of the most stable populations in Europe for a long time, mainly because of their own rules about who you can marry and the rules implemented by christians. What I do do is question validity of "historical rights" when the basis of those "rights" is over two millenia old and is mostly based on a religious book. Jewish case rests pretty much only on "YHWH promised us" and that's it. If we accept that they have historic rights to the land we also must accept each and every other claim going back to the beginning of history.

I also contend the concept of an "ethnic jew". As far as I know it's a fabrication from the 19th century made up by zionists so they could claim more popularity. As ethnicity jews are semitic, just as all the people who originated from that region. "Ethnic jew" makes no more sense than a "ethnic hindu" or a "ethnic shintoist". I'm not an "ethnic christian" with atheistic tendencies.

I also don't care what the borders of ancient Israel were any more than what the borders of ancient Rome were. It's irrelevant in modern days. Of course Arab leaders didn't accept the borders, why would they? They were basically being robbed of their land, demanded that they give land which they controlled for pretty much centuries to immigrants. The UN 1947 dividing plan demanded that the local arabs give control of large portions of their land over to the new Israel state, without guarantees of ownership rights being respected. As much as the UN didn't like it, war was the only option for either side.

 

[televator]

See, no, Israel has to do SOMETHING about the fact that there are people strapping bombs to their chest and blowing themselves up in public places.

Perhaps that something could be anything other than egregious disregard for civilians. Like blowing up a building that you yourself told said civilians to hide in. Heck, how about not using missiles in heavily populated urban areas.

This would happen whether or not Israel retaliates for it.

Wait, wat? Did you just make a point against yourself? I think you did. Pretty sure you did. :?

If the suicide bombings will continue no matter what (as you said yourself)...wouldn't retaliation be wasted effort on Israel's part?

What would happen if say, islamic militants took over canada and started lobbing rockets into buffalo from Fort Erie. Would you expect the U.S. to wait for a U.N. resolution sanctioning military action to roll in and stop it? No. No you wouldn't.

You know what I wouldn't expect? Obvious neglectful tactics that increased the casualties of the citizens of Canada and actually begin to blur who the real bad guy is from the perspective of those citizens. I also wouldn't expect the US to suddenly deny Canada any sovereignty, effectively annex it, treat the its citizenry like second class people, perpetuate tension and ill will, and pretty much telegraph to the whole world that the US has no intentions of creating a peaceful resolution with the now fearful and untrusting Canadians.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

Quick clarification: I didn't mean that the Mexican border is there to keep out suicide bombers. I'm obviously saying that wall around Israel is meant to keep out Palestinian suicide bombers and terrorists. Thought it would be pretty damn obvious from the context. It's their border so they have a right to use whatever protection they deem fit.

 

[Prolescum]

Quick clarification: I didn't mean that the Mexican border is there to keep out suicide bombers. I'm obviously saying that wall around Israel is meant to keep out Palestinian suicide bombers and terrorists. Thought it would be pretty damn obvious from the context. It's their border so they have a right to use whatever protection they deem fit.

"Obviously" :lol:

Ah, context. I love context. It is, as I always say, key. In my experience, context only matters to you when it suits you.

Okay, let's look at the context:

Dogma's Reprise[/url]"]Funny that you mentioned the wall around Israel as something bad.

It's "funny" that I mentioned the wall around Israel as something bad. We can infer from this that you are either neutral or consider it something "good" at this point, yes?

Actually, let's not get ahead of ourselves... You say I mentioned it as "something bad", and it's "funny" that I did so. Why is that, I wonder?

Let's look at why you thought it was "funny". To explain, you give us a comparison:

Is the Mexican border an "apartheid" or "oppression" or whatever you want to call it?

No. No it isn't either of those things... and you even agree:

No, it's [the Mexican/US border] just a border

So it's just a national border. Oh wait, there's a coordinating conjunction...

and it was meant to keep suicidal fuckers out and other terrorists.

There is no mistake on my part here; you are attempting to equate the Israeli West Bank Barrier (to use its proper name) with a national border when even Israelis understand that it is no such thing, (as you say, it is ostensibly to "keep suicidal fuckers and other terrorists out").
The Israeli West Bank Barrier isn't just a border, and to suggest it is comparable with the Mexican/US border is completely disingenuous (quelle surprise!); it doesn't even follow the green line that acts as the actual border (mainly because of new Israeli settlements in agreed Palestinian territory)!

Whether or not you meant to suggest that the Mexican border was intended to stop "suicidal fuckers and other terrorists out" is really neither here nor there (as I've already stated, the comparison is risible), but easy to poke fun at. I'm really not convinced that you knew anything about the Mexican/US border (except that it often comes up in anti-immigration literature and tabloid/sensationalist journalism) and I think you assumed no one would bat an eyelid.

I would grant that you constructed your paragraph poorly, but the sheer volume of spurious crap I've read coming from your fingers means you no longer have the benefit of the doubt; everything you say is suspect as far as I'm concerned.

Now, feel free to address the rest of my criticisms.

Do you still contend that the UNHRC having representatives from dodgy countries is a valid reason for Israel to ignore the General Assembly and the Security Council, and can dismiss their responsibilities as members of the UN?

Do you still contend that because "the UN is a joke these days", Israel should continue ignoring the international community and international laws, despite resolutions outstanding for decades?

Do you concede that despite their own laws and regulations, there is an evident disparity between Arab-Israelis and Israelis?

Will you do some research into the British Mandate and the creation of the state of Israel, taking into consideration what we may call "classical Israel" (for argument's sake), and make a lucid argument for Israel's "historical" right to the territory?

If I've forgotten anything, feel free to address that too.

 

[Unwardil]

Bad wording on my part.

I meant that the suicide bombers are not suicide bombing in retaliation to Israel's blunt force use of military power, they are doing it in retaliation for Israel's continued existence as a state. The Israeli government and military would be lax in it's duty to their people if they didn't hunt down people like that, especially when they are in such great quantity.

When a criminal kills 10 people then flees to another country, you bet your ass that the government of said country is going to do everything they can to get that criminal back. If proper legal channels exist for doing so, they generally use them, but no proper channels exist for dealing with suicide bombers and the people who fund them.

Finally the hypocrisy of the anti Israel argument is rather startlingly obvious. Suicide bombing is the same tactic you accuse Israel of employing. Sending a guided bomb to cause as much civilian casualties as possible. Why is it less moral when the more technologically advanced side does it? At the very least they are exactly equivalently moral actions. An insurgent group fires a suicide bomber in exactly the same way that a fighter pilot fires a guided missile. The difference is the price tag. The fighter plane and guided missile costs a lot more money the suicide bomber costs exactly 1 life.

That sums up the conflict pretty well in my eyes. Israel is prepared to spend an awful lot of money in order to keep it's people safe while they're opponents are willing to kill themselves in order to make Israel disappear.

 

[Prolescum]

Bad wording on my part.

I meant that the suicide bombers are not suicide bombing in retaliation to Israel's blunt force use of military power, they are doing it in retaliation for Israel's continued existence as a state.

Citations, please.

The Israeli government and military would be lax in it's duty to their people if they didn't hunt down people like that, especially when they are in such great quantity.

Define "great quantity", please, and make sure it is in relation to your earlier statement that the suicide bombers are doing it in retaliation for Israel's continued existence as a state.

Thanks.

When a criminal kills 10 people then flees to another country, you bet your ass that the government of said country is going to do everything they can to get that criminal back. If proper legal channels exist for doing so, they generally use them, but no proper channels exist for dealing with suicide bombers and the people who fund them.

Could you expand here? What do you mean by "there are no proper channels for dealing with suicide bombers and the people who fund them"? It seems, on the face of it, that you are saying that because there is no extradition treaty between the PA and Israel, Israel should just wantonly blow shit up; is that the case you're making?

Finally the hypocrisy of the anti Israel argument is rather startlingly obvious. Suicide bombing is the same tactic you accuse Israel of employing. Sending a guided bomb to cause as much civilian casualties as possible. Why is it less moral when the more technologically advanced side does it? At the very least they are exactly equivalently moral actions.

Neither blowing the shit out of Palestine willy-nilly or sending bombers into Israeli markets is "moral". That isn't the "anti-Israeli argument" either. Are you really under the impression there is only one? Come now...

An insurgent group fires a suicide bomber in exactly the same way that a fighter pilot fires a guided missile. The difference is the price tag. The fighter plane and guided missile costs a lot more money the suicide bomber costs exactly 1 life.

That sums up the conflict pretty well in my eyes.

Then I humbly suggest you acquire a third eye.

Israel is prepared to spend an awful lot of money in order to keep it's people safe while they're opponents are willing to kill themselves in order to make Israel disappear.

You seem totally ignorant of the decades of proposed/implemented agreements between Israel, the PA and various nearby states that included recognition of Israel as a sovereign nation, many of which were signed with the pre-condition that Israel stops building settlements on the West Bank (back to the already agreed borders) and allows Palestinian self-determination.

 

[televator]

Bad wording on my part.

I meant that the suicide bombers are not suicide bombing in retaliation to Israel's blunt force use of military power, they are doing it in retaliation for Israel's continued existence as a state.

Personally, I don't pretend to know the mind of a suicide bomber with any degree of certainty. However, the use of blunt military force certainly can't be endearing to Palestinians affected by it and doing something for revenge is not unheard of.

The Israeli government and military would be lax in it's duty to their people if they didn't hunt down people like that, especially when they are in such great quantity.

I'm with Prole on wanting some more to go on here.

When a criminal kills 10 people then flees to another country, you bet your ass that the government of said country is going to do everything they can to get that criminal back. If proper legal channels exist for doing so, they generally use them, but no proper channels exist for dealing with suicide bombers and the people who fund them.

So how do we go from that to "lets roll over on civilians even when it's avoidable and never make a peaceful resolve." type of mentality?

Finally the hypocrisy of the anti Israel argument is rather startlingly obvious. Suicide bombing is the same tactic you accuse Israel of employing. Sending a guided bomb to cause as much civilian casualties as possible. Why is it less moral when the more technologically advanced side does it?

Prole is right in asserting that neither is moral (thus making your claim of hypocrisy false) , but what you have manged to do in this statement makes Israel look even worse here. Lets see... A technologically superior faction still resorting to the same indiscriminant brutal practices of a technologically stumped opponent... Not only that, but the Israeli state holds the upper hand in almost innumerable ways against Palestine and still they stoop to the same level as suicide bombing zealots. I think that says a lot about Israel.

At the very least they are exactly equivalently moral actions. An insurgent group fires a suicide bomber in exactly the same way that a fighter pilot fires a guided missile. The difference is the price tag. The fighter plane and guided missile costs a lot more money the suicide bomber costs exactly 1 life.

That sums up the conflict pretty well in my eyes. Israel is prepared to spend an awful lot of money in order to keep it's people safe while they're opponents are willing to kill themselves in order to make Israel disappear.

So now that you're willing to call things down the middle, what makes Israel worth defending to you? Is it the notion that Israel is trying to keep its people safe that is the difference for you? If people deserve to be kept safe, what about the civilians who get caught in the cross fire in Palestine? Don't they deserve a state to watch over them?

 

[Dogma's Demise]

There's some form of discrimination, but then again we hear about racism in USA, including police brutality against African Americans. Yet nobody calls (present day) USA an "apartheid state" because of these shortcomings. You'll need to do better than that.

The Guardian article by the way doesn't seem to make a distinction between Israeli Arabs (citizens of Israel) and Palestinians Arabs.

Right, so you insist that the UN is doing a good thing even though they've already shown what little moral credibility they hav? Fine, there's a better reason why those resolutions don't mean jack shit. They are simply unrealistic, inapplicable in practice because the Palestinians act and have always acted in bad faith.

So let's take for example resolution 1397 of UNSC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_1397

- told Palestinians to end the acts of terrorism
- told Israeli to get out of Gaza and West Bank
- called for a two-state solution


Now the two-state thing has already been tried in 1948. Guess what? The Jews accepted, the Arabs didn't accept, they went to war. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Arab%E2%80%93Israeli_War In the end they got nothing. But from 1948 to 1967 West Bank was under Jordanian rule, Gaza under Egypt. No Israeli occupation. Why didnt they try to form an indepedent Palestinian state and where was the Palestinian outrage against Egyptian/Jordanian occupation?

Palestinians formed the PLO in 1964 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_Liberation_Organization ) and started committing acts of violence and terrorism against Israel. If you're going to act like a terrorist, fuck yeah you should be kept on a leash. And by the way, the PLO logo says a lot about them:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/fe/Plo_emblem.png

That's right, the PLO agenda was the abolition of Israel.

In late 1993 (Oslo Accords) Israel negotiated with the PLO and helped establish a Palestinian government (Palestinian National Authority) an attempt at peace. Terrorist attacks increased, here's two quote from Yasser Arafat for example "We know only one word, jihad! Jihad, jihad, jihad! Whoever does not like it can drink from the Dead Sea or from the Sea of Gaza" also "We plan to eliminate the State of Israel and establish a purely Palestinian state. We will make life unbearable for Jews by psychological warfare and population explosion"¦ We Palestinians will take over everything, including all of Jerusalem." Faisal al-Husseini (Arafat's associate) even described the Oslo Accords as a "Trojan Horse", hmmm, who doesn't want peace?

See: http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_current_yassir_arafat.php

2000-2005 (Second Intifada) saw another surge of Palestinian violence. And by the way, for those complaining about civilian casualties, well Palestinians killed more civilians (percentage-wise) than Israelis killed Palestinian civilians. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Intifada

Fuck, there were even hundreds of Palestinians killed by other Palestinians, their leaders have no concept of human rights. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Intifada#Palestinians_killed_by_Palestinians

In 2005 Israel completely withdrew from Gaza, what did the Palestinians do? Increased rocket attacks of course and use old settlements as terrorist training camps. (Like this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neve_Dekalim )


The Palestinian leadership is like a rabid dog that you can't get let off its leash even for 3 seconds without someone being bitten. Power is largely split into either Hamas (an extremist Islamist terrorist group) or Fatah.

Hamas has made it clear - There's no peace to be had with Israel, no recognition of any of its territories. They want all of the land to be part of a Palestinian state and the best Israel could hope for is a temporary truce, but the ultimate goal is complete destruction of Israel.

http://www.terrorism-info.org.il/malam_multimedia/English/eng_n/pdf/hamas_charter.pdf

Fatah isn't far off. Another Islamist anti-Israel group. Here's what Fatah Central Committee Member Abbas Zaki says:

"If one says that one wants to wipe Israel out... C'mon, it's too difficult. It's not (acceptable) policy to say so. Don't say these things to the world. Keep it to yourself."

http://www.memri.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/3130.htm

"Keep it to yourself." - WTF does that even mean? Here, let me help, imagine one of these public figures (take your pic, Robert Spencer, Tommy Robinson, Pat Condell etc.) that are always speaking out against radical or politcal Islam said "Don't say kick out brown people, it's not acceptable policy. Just say you oppose radical Islam. Keep the rest to yourself." (You already show signs of believing this conspiracy anyway.)


Israel is dealing with people that are for the most part untrustworthy. It's no wonder a lot of those resolutions are inapplicable and there's no easy solution to peace.

My prediction is, if Israel gives them full controll of Gaza+West Bank+all the other parts seized after the 1948 war, they're just going to continue making demands, launching terrorist attacks, launching missiles etc. Plus the borders would be much harder to defend if they followed the 1947 partition. It cannot work as long the zone is under Fatah/Hamas and as long as there's so much bad faith and violence on the Palestinian side. (Go back to my analogy of a rabid dog you can't let off its leash.)

Plus I don't support Islamist dictatorship pseudo-democracies so that's another extra reason to be pro-Israel. I know Israel's no saint, but by comparison, it's better.


Also check out these videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAuBc_cbXo0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f81j5Zk-GSA

I'm really not convinced that you knew anything about the Mexican/US border (except that it often comes up in anti-immigration literature and tabloid/sensationalist journalism) and I think you assumed no one would bat an eyelid.

The thing I know about the Mexican/US border is that it needs to be there, like any national border. :lol: America seems to have a problem with illegal immigrants coming from that region even with it, so imagine how bad it would be without: more human traffickers, thieves and gang members.

There's nothing wrong with being Mexican of course, but they should follow immigration rules and obey the law if they want to become citizens and work there.

 

[Prolescum]

My apologies, but I can't respond until Monday at the earliest because I'm playing Truthislife7 in a stage adaptation of his life story, Dotoree is not the only fruit.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

No problem, we'll wait.

 

[bluejatheist]

"War is a Force That Gives Us Meaning" by Chris Hedges is a good book to read that touches on the Arab/Israli conflict among many others.

 

[Sandracottus]

Someone show me ANY three week period in the last 30 years where more Israelis were killed than Palestinians, and I'll reconsider the obviously bullshit notion that Israel is oppressing the Palestinians out of existential fear. A FUCKING DECADE AGO I had this same argument with a pro-Israel psychopath who pointed me to a link where she claimed that Israel was threatened by Palestinians, and the death ratio was about the same as in this article, over a hundred dead Palestinians for each dead Israeli.

(Ah nice ! My name is also Joe or Joseph to be exact)



Many Muslims suffer from an irrational fear of the Jews. Some Muslim children, are taught that the Jews are evil, that they eat Muslim children and make pastries with their blood. Jews are caricatured in derogatory and demonized ways, depicted as bloodsucking monsters. In a television show aired in Palestine a three year old child was interviewed and asked what she hates most, and when she responded "the Jews", the journalists praised Allah upon hearing this stupid remark . Those who defend Islam constantly attempt to blur the line between the criticism of Islam and the criticism of Muslims.



Joe.....Israel is the only country on Earth that has the guts to fight Islam head on without any pretensions.If other nations dont join the war, civilization is at stake.You really think Palestinians want peace? You really think their hatred and violence would cease if Israel gives up lands'? You are underestimating the power of religion in guiding the feelings of man.You are forgetting the record Islam has left upon history. You are forgetting Pedophile MOMOs own crimes upon Jews, which muzzies are to emulate.

Joe.....I have been unfortunate enough to have seen original videos of these wicked Palestinian terrorists beheading Christians and Jews .WHAT KIND OF NORMAL HUMAN BEINGS CAN DO THAT?...You know man, I couldn't eat anything for 2 days after watching those videos . Nor will you. They changed me forever. Hamas and Hezbollah and also the repulsive , most atrocious things the Al shabab and allies do in the NAME, OF ALLAH. Maybe you dont have the guts to watch them.Maybe you have too much guts and so can remain unaffected and unmoved even if you watched them .I did. And my resolution to fight this curse has only increased...No Human being who loves freedom and who has compassion for human life can condone this sort of culling of humans as though they were poultry.

Do you honestly believe that these "poor" palestinians would spare a single Jew if they defeated Israel?

Do you not understand the implications of that notorious Koranic verse 5.60 --"He made apes and swine, and he who served the Shaitan; these are worse in place and more erring from the straight path. "...??

Much much more muzzies have been killed and are being killed daily (as in Porkistan) in the Shia Sunni conflict than all the causalities of the Palestinian conflict.....MUZZIES ARE THE BIGGEST THREAT TO MUZZIES

Look at some scary stats from the religionofpeace website

More people are killed by Islamists each year than in all 350 years of the Spanish Inquisition combined

Islamic terrorists murder more people every day than the Ku Klux Klan has in the last 50 years

More civilians were killed by Muslim extremists in two hours on September 11th than in the 36 years of sectarian conflict in Northern Ireland

19 Muslim hijackers killed more innocents in two hours on September 11th than the number of American criminals executed in the last 65 years

18,000 deadly terror attacks committed explicitly in the name of Islam in just the last ten years. (Other religions combined for perhaps a dozen or so).


What makes you think Palestinians are any different?.....Only those people have survived the Islamic onslaught, who were willing to fight back, who were willing to descent atleast partly to the levels of muzzie barbarity---Spanish, Indians, Jews, Mongols etc

ISLAM AND ITS SLAVES SIMPLY CANNOT BE JUSTIFIED

If you oppose the Israeli state ....Then you must also oppose the Republic of India

Once upon a time, all of Palestine was Jewish.Once upon a time all of South Asia, Central Asia ,and South East Asia was Buddhist and HIndu. Jews were expelled or oppressed forced to leave, just as Hindus and Buddhists were from Afghan, Pork , Kashmir and Bengal.


Jews merely took back what was forcibly taken from them-their land. Porkies, on the other hand, forcibly tore away the holy Saptha sindhu from Bharath and expelled Hindus, and Sikhs.Israel never started religious wars but only ended them by responding with equal vigour.Porkis stated 4 wars .Most importantly, Israel is the only piece of land Jews have, just as Aryavartha is what Hindus and Sikhs have-Islam has lots of lands it took from kafirs.How unkind of you !wont you let them Jews have a tiny piece of land?

India on the other hand was attacked 4 times by Pork ,each time Pork was crushed and yet no POW was killed, no Porky civilian harmed, no Porky resources destroyed.India simply forgives each time. Is that Good or Bad? What would America have done to Pork?

This behavior of Porkies and Palestinians are not the normal behavior of normal nations.

The Muslim community is enjoined not to cooperate on the basis of equality or peaceful coexistence with Kafirs. To them it offers some alternatives-conversion to Islam, or death, or slavery. It invaded Palestine, India and just about everywhere else not to co-exist with it but to wipe it out. But in spite of repeated endeavours India could not be converted. Had India been completely converted to Islam, its people, like those of Iran or Libya, would have taken pride in organising Islamic revolutions, spearheading pan-Islamic movements. Or, had Hindus the determination and the wherewithal to throw out Islam from India as was done by the Christians in some countries like Spain, there would have been no Muslim problem in India today


I am a self respecting, tolerant human when I fight the intolerant motivation of hordes of libertine animals fueled by a monotheist fury descends upon my country, harass the populace rather than just the soldiers, abduct women, establish slavery, Tax my countrymen 25 % for living in their own country, make an insatiable hobby of destroying temples and monasteries, of burning libraries, with a least sense of honor in constructing madrassas out of those very temple materials, chop down ancient pillars, insult ,torture and murder Hindus, Buddhists, Jains and Sikhs in thousands, plunder the largest economy, devastate the peasantry and be willing to kill me upon the Koranic promise of a heavenly brothel in with rivers of Rum flow

See how brutal Muzzies are to each other.Then you can Imagine the levels of cruelties muslims would happily inflict on nonmuslims, as they always have.Three of the first four Muslim rulers (caliphs) were murdered. All of them were among Muhammad's closest companions. The third caliph was killed by allies of the son of the first (who was murdered by the fifth caliph a few years later, then wrapped in the skin of a dead donkey and burned). The fourth caliph (Ali) was stabbed to death after a bitter dispute with the fifth. The fifth caliph went on to poison one of Muhammad's two, favorite grandsons. The other grandson was later beheaded by the sixth caliph. The infighting and power struggles between Muhammad's family members, closest companions and their children only intensified with time. Within 50 short years of Muhammad's death, even the Kaaba, which had stood for centuries under pagan religion, lay in ruins from internal Muslim war.



ALLAH YOU R****RBAR

ON THE SEVENTH DAY HE SHIT AND A PEDO MOMO WAS BORN

 

[Dogma's Demise]

I cringe when I see pro-Palestinian propaganda such as this:



"Do we forget that the Palestinians never invited the state of Israel to come into existence?"

:roll:

Then we have this guy:



So basically he KNOWS the Palestinian leaders do not recognize Israel's right to exist (they only accept its existence as a "fact"), but yet he thinks a two-state solution with pre-67 borders is viable, despite the Palestinians' constant desires of waging war and taking back ALL of the land in that area.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Sandracottus... you're a sociopath and a bigot, on top of being too fucking ignorant for words. If you think Israel's subjugation and mass murder of Palestinians are self-defense, or that hurting an occupied people somehow keeps you safe from the nonexistent threat of a worldwide Islamic takeover, there's something more wrong with you than anyone here should be forced to deal with. I'm certainly not going to engage with you, any more than I'd sit down and have a conversation with a homeless drug-addled schizophrenic.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

We'll take you seriously when you start condemning the PNA's reckless disregard for human rights, both among their own people and in relation with Israel.

Of course you won't do that because you're an Islamized leftie.

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

We'll

That's cute.
He's implying that two equally biggoted people somehow represents a reasonable majority where Joe would actually feel the need to justify being a rational person.

EDIT:
Changed "thinks" to "implying"

 

[ImprobableJoe]

That's cute.
He thinks that two equally biggoted people somehow represents a reasonable majority where Joe would actually feel the need to justify being a rational person.

The bolded bit is where you went wrong. I wouldn't call what either of those two are doing "thinking," would you?

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

I fixed the post to suit. I needed the word "Implying" in that sentence somewhere anyways.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Further, I'm not surprised that someone who thinks that two people form a majority would be anti-Muslim bigots based on the words and deeds of a few scattered radicals and some admittedly fucked up regimes that nevertheless have no influence or power outside of their boarders. "Saudi Arabia has anti-woman policies, therefore it is OK for Israel to commit acts of terrorism against Palestinian civilians" isn't a rational position, it is irrational and inhuman.