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This may be partly why there is anti-Islam prejudice

arg-fallbackName="Lallapalalable"/>
Dogma's Demise said:
You can also try to find out what they believe about certain topics like equality of men and women, equality between Muslims and non-Muslims, amputations, capital punishment for anything other than murder, Caliphate vs. democracy and secularism etc.
True, but most people aren't keen on being prodded for information like that. In fact, doing so can be downright offensive, as it implies I believe they could very well be the 'bad guys,' and if you're not familiar with America's PC culture, that automatically makes me "Ignorant Douche Numero Uno," a title I am just fine never accepting.

But honestly, it's not the individuals that concern me, rather the echelon of the religion, the Imams and such that preach to their obedient followers the hate fueled rhetoric that leads to people deciding to strap a bomb to something or someone in the name of their religion. I see your leaders getting on TV and saying how every one of us wants you dead or converted, and how any non-Muslim is a threat to you, then in a piece of irony I still can't get over, say that we should be converted or killed, I have no real option but to feel defensive and paranoid. Unfounded? Perhaps. My leaders doing likewise and lying about your message? Just as likely. But I play defensively, and a risk is a risk. I'll give the individual the benefit of the doubt, but until I see the Grand Chief Imam (or Muslim Pope, whatever the equivalent would be) say "Hey, lets just try and cooperate, this time without weaponry" I don't think Islam as a whole has much of a chance of being universally accepted as a peaceful, tolerant religion.

Then again, the fact that you folks hate each other over who was the rightful heir to the Caliphate 1300 years ago and continue to fight a bloody fight over it does not give much hope to the cause. Love each other, love yourselves, then we can work on the inter-faith love.
 
arg-fallbackName="Dogma's Demise"/>
Lallapalalable said:
True, but most people aren't keen on being prodded for information like that. In fact, doing so can be downright offensive, as it implies I believe they could very well be the 'bad guys,' and if you're not familiar with America's PC culture, that automatically makes me "Ignorant Douche Numero Uno," a title I am just fine never accepting.

Well, I didn't mean directly, wait for the right context so they don't feel threatened.

And with some people it's probably better to just let it go altogether.
Lallapalalable said:
But honestly, it's not the individuals that concern me, rather the echelon of the religion

Regarding Islamic authorities, I think you're about as likely to find a pro-western or secularist among them as you are likely to find a Christian authority who condones premarital sex. Most Christians might "neglect" that command, but the priests know better. ;)

Islam is a religion with a strong political component, always has been, they have various schools of jurisprudence (most Muslims are Sunni and fall under either Hanafi, Shafi'i, Hanbali or Maliki) that provide various laws for governing society, whether it's family matters, business matters, criminal matters (complete with earthly punishments, many that would make westerners cringe) or warfare. (And as far as I can tell they promote warfare against non-believers simply for being non-believers. That's certainly in line with the 9th chapter of the Qur'an, verse 29.) Also, all of them make a sharp distinction between Muslim and non-Muslim citizens (dhimmis) of the Islamic state and between men and women. None of this has ever been declared heretical.

Now, I also often listen to various Islamic apologists and so-called "moderates" (like Hamza Tzortis, Abdullah Al-Andalusi, Sami Zaatari and yes DawahFilms, given that he does consider himself a moderate) and it's always the same bullshit, the same whitewashing of inconvenient Islamic tradition or Qur'anic texts, the same anti-western propaganda (either openly or by stealth), the same desire to bring back the Caliphate.
 
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