Park51 or the "Ground Zero Mosque"

[Dogma's Demise]

This all sounds very, very familiar...

Hardly represents me. The guy wants to ban religion.

I do identify as an "anti-theist" but not the kind of anti-theism he preaches.

It's clear I'm dealing with a very biased individual if he can't make a distinction between banning religion and taking measures to limit the spread of radical religious ideas that threaten our freedom by more immigration control.


So at best we share what? 1% beliefs? But that's "familiar".... :roll:

But a lot of Muslims probably want to live in a Sharia dominated society, the proportion of those who would actively take steps to implement it are significantly less.

All it takes then is a few fanatics becoming politically involved and those, otherwise less confrontational fundies will soon show support. Do you want to take that chance?

I'm against the monarchy in Britain, but that doesn't mean I'm going to take steps to overthrow them.

But if there was ever some referendum or something on it, you'd voice your opinion right?

Perhaps you need to define 'advocating' because as I say most Muslims probably advocate some form of Sharia law (I'm not sure if you are aware that there are different interpretations) - it comes with being Muslim. What about Jews who advocate Jewish law?

I honestly do not know of any Jewish group that wants to impose its legal system. Not even Israel is a theocracy.

 

[australopithecus]

All it takes then is a few fanatics becoming politically involved and those, otherwise less confrontational fundies will soon show support. Do you want to take that chance?

I'll take the chance, because there's not any chance any group of fanatical Muslims would ever get a motion passed through the Parliament of Great Britian that would legalise Sharia Law as the official law of the land.

But if there was ever some referendum or something on it, you'd voice your opinion right?

Yes, and if there were a referendum on Sharia I'd expect people to voice their opinions on it, except in your world anyone who agrees with it would have been refused entry or deported before they got that chance.

 

[bluejatheist]

Okay so I wanted to say a word or two about this Islamic community center Park51, built very close to Ground Zero (where WTC fell). I know it's a bit of an old issue now, but I never really got the chance to talk about it.

Now, this may come as a shock to a few of you, but I think they had a right to build it. After all, they bought the land, they brought in the money, federal funding was denied as it should be it in any secular world: http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/united-states/no-federal-funds-for-islamic-community-center-says-group-60675.html


When I say "they had a right" I don't mean however that I think this idea is worthy of any kind of respect. I think it's a tasteless and provocative gesture, an insult to the victims of 9/11 to construct anything "Islamic" (community center, mosque, both etc.) in close proximity to Ground Zero. (Keep in mind, even though it's not ON Ground Zero, it's still on a place where debris fell.)

(Did I mention it was initially called "Cordoba House" - Hmmm a reference to Islamic conquest of Cordoba? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%C3%B3rdoba,_Andalusia#History )

It would be akin to, well let's say a pack of street dogs attack and kill some children (and this wouldn't be hypothetical at all, my country Romania has a very serious street dog infestation). And then a few years later The Romanian Misanthropic Association Vier Pfoten or some other animal welfare nazi NGO decided to build a center for promotion of dog welfare specifically on that same street on in relatively close proximity where the children were killed. Let's say they also applied for state funding (yes, taking money from everyone, including the victims' families to support their bullshit plans).

Yes, now that would be very tasteless as well. It never happened, but then again I wouldn't be surprised given the idiocy frequently displayed by these animal welfare activists: lies, propaganda, victim-blaming, fueling the problem etc. (Some of you westerners may have seen the negative coverage my country gets on this issue, when all people here want are clean streets without dogs running free and biting people.)

Or another example: WBC funeral protests. Completely inappropriate, provocative, degrading, fucking retarded, you name it.


(And to clarify in advance, I'm not against animal welfare - within reason - I'm just tired of this bullshit that it's somehow "immoral" to put a dog to sleep, even when painless, humane methods are used.)

Just thought I'd reiterate the original post. Y'know, to keep things relevant.

 

[australopithecus]

Topics go off track, it's the internet. I'm not losing any sleep over it.

 

[bluejatheist]

Topics go off track, it's the internet. I'm not losing any sleep over it.

People weaseling out of hard arguments and towards more defensible ones is annoying to me, is all.

 

[australopithecus]

He doesn't have any argument, especially not a more defensible one. You can press him on Park 51 again, by all means. Don't expect a sensible reply though. He already tried to run away once, I suspect another attempt isn't far behind.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

He doesn't have any argument

I already presented my case, you presented yours, now we're just going in circles on this issue.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Topics go off track, it's the internet. I'm not losing any sleep over it.

People weaseling out of hard arguments and towards more defensible ones is annoying to me, is all.

He doesn't have an argument besides bigotry against Muslims, so what do you really expect?

Maybe this has been a useful thread, since we've spelled out several different ways you can show that opposition to Park 51 is stupid and bigoted, but getting something useful out of the person displaying the bigotry is unlikely.

 

[Duvelthehobbit666]

I heard there is a Pastafarian church opening in Somalia. Are you against that too because of the havoc pirates created there?

So what is your opinion on this Dogma's Demise?

 

[australopithecus]

I already presented my case, you presented yours, now we're just going in circles on this issue.

You presented nothing except biased opinion. If that what constitutes a case these days then bad luck, world.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

Well aren't you "bigoted" against people who are "bigoted" against Park51?

I heard there is a Pastafarian church opening in Somalia. Are you against that too because of the havoc pirates created there?

So what is your opinion on this Dogma's Demise?

My opinion is that you're being silly. :lol: (Can I say that?)

 

[ImprobableJoe]

You presented nothing except biased opinion. If that what constitutes a case these days then bad luck, world.

Well... at least it isn't Zeitgeist, right? :lol:

 

[australopithecus]

Well aren't you "bigoted" against people who are "bigoted" against Park51?

You're neither as smart nor as funny as you think you are.

My opinion is that you're being silly. :lol: (Can I say that?)

You can say what you like, however if you continue to add nothing of any substance when asked a question you'll find yourself going the same was as Stripe. He did the same thing, now his posting privilages have been pushed back a few months.

 

[Duvelthehobbit666]

My opinion is that you're being silly. :lol: (Can I say that?)

How is my argument different than yours?

 

[Dogma's Demise]

My opinion is that you're being silly. :lol: (Can I say that?)

How is my argument different than yours?

Well let's see.

1. The story is fake.
2. Pastafarianism is a parody religion.
3. Pastafarianism has nothing to do with pirates in Somalia. They attack because they're poor. (Not defending piracy by the way.)

 

[australopithecus]

3. Pastafarianism has nothing to do with pirates in Somalia.

Fundamentalist Islam used to justify politically motivated terrorism has nothing to do with the Muslim community of New York. Glad we agree. Thanks for playing.

 

[CosmicJoghurt]

3. Pastafarianism has nothing to do with pirates in Somalia.

Fundamentalist Islam used to justify politically motivated terrorism has nothing to do with the Muslim community of New York. Glad we agree. Thanks for playing.

*clap* *clap* *clap*

 

[ImprobableJoe]

3. Pastafarianism has nothing to do with pirates in Somalia.

Fundamentalist Islam used to justify politically motivated terrorism has nothing to do with the Muslim community of New York. Glad we agree. Thanks for playing.

We've been saying that since page one... do you think he will read, understand, and internalize it now?

 

[bluejatheist]

Anyone feel like Hugo Weaving here?

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

3. Pastafarianism has nothing to do with pirates in Somalia.

Fundamentalist Islam used to justify politically motivated terrorism has nothing to do with the Muslim community of New York. Glad we agree. Thanks for playing.

This all sounds very, very familiar...

Hardly represents me.

Totalitarian mindset. Banning of Free Speech and Freedom of Thought in the name of Free Speech and Free Thought.
Using hanging definitions that have nothing to do with the topic.

But, then again, at the very least UltimateBlasphemer could keep on topic.