What are your thoughts on the Venus Project?

[Finger]

Wait, and no government either? SO basically anarchy? That Definitely won't work, humans just aren't good enough for such a system.

Yeah. Of course everything would be perfect if everyone in the world was 100% devoted to the exact same ideal, working together and holding hands and building round buildings. Unfortunately, people rarely agree on anything. Yelling and screaming that they should doesn't do much to help the situation. Which is why history has shown that it is far more practical to have a government that expects this sort of thing. Anarchy, even an emergent peaceful anarchy, is a Utopian fantasy and has very little difference from the ideals behind communism and no basis in reality.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Yeah. Of course everything would be perfect if everyone in the world was 100% devoted to the exact same ideal, working together and holding hands and building round buildings. Unfortunately, people rarely agree on anything. Yelling and screaming that they should doesn't do much to help the situation. Which is why history has shown that it is far more practical to have a government that expects this sort of thing. Anarchy, even an emergent peaceful anarchy, is a Utopian fantasy and has very little difference from the ideals behind communism and no basis in reality.

What's interesting to me is that the "free market" Capitalists, the Communists, the Anarchists, the religious fundamentalists, and now the Venusian alien utopians... they all share an identical worldview. That worldview can be boiled down to this: "everything would be better if everyone just agreed with me 100%, and everything can ultimately be blamed on the fact that other people disagree. When our ideas fail, it is not because they are bad ideas, but because we were not ideologically pure enough" Except for the occasional fundie, none of these groups ever really state that outright, and I'm sure most of them don't even realize it. The underlying belief in all of these cases seems to be that if enough people get on board, there will be an almost supernatural "tipping point" where bad ideas suddenly become good ideas.

You can see it with the "free market" cultists as an example. We've seen that the result of deregulation of the financial sector and weakening of oversight has led to a worldwide market crisis. What makes "free market" Capitalism a cult is that when faced with the fact that deregulation led directly to disaster, they answer that the problem was that there was any regulation at all. That flies in the face of any sane reading of the evidence, but that's where they are. They believe that even though cutting regulation in half makes things 10 times worse, at some point if you cut it far enough it creates a magical situation where things become better than they were when they were regulated.

The Communists had the same sort of script: if only we could make enough countries Communist, and weed out enough dissidents, the disaster of our system will reach a tipping point where it suddenly starts producing positive results. Anarchists are just dumb, and Venusians have their heads in the Star Trek clouds.

 

[lightbulbsun88]

Am I not allowed to be given time to gather the information needed? Specific things were told to me, and given me time I can formulate my argument. The only thing that seems to be it is that specific things were missqouted or missinterpreted, like the whole global warming thing.

As far as this goes; This should be a League of Reason as in allowing someone time to gather their argument; not League of Speculation because this guy said someone else told him makes it invalid. I never state that the government did it; I only state the official story does not add up. I suppose I should just leave since people here are not that open to ideas and particular discussion just because I would need time to gather my evidence.

Ok, here's a tip of advice then: Before you post any claims on here, do the research first so you're not fumbling around for information midway through the topic.

 

[IamtheVOICE123]

Wait, and no government either? SO basically anarchy? That Definitely won't work, humans just aren't good enough for such a system.

You need to look up Anarchy because it is a transitional period from something that is wanted, to something that is desired. Their is a film by a youtube called shanklinmike that has a video outlining this. Anyways, Anarchy has a central form of thought stating that "it's everyone for themselves." Try looking at the history or Russia.

 

[IamtheVOICE123]

What's interesting to me is that the "free market" Capitalists, the Communists, the Anarchists, the religious fundamentalists, and now the Venusian alien utopians... they all share an identical worldview. That worldview can be boiled down to this: "everything would be better if everyone just agreed with me 100%, and everything can ultimately be blamed on the fact that other people disagree. When our ideas fail, it is not because they are bad ideas, but because we were not ideologically pure enough" Except for the occasional fundie, none of these groups ever really state that outright, and I'm sure most of them don't even realize it. The underlying belief in all of these cases seems to be that if enough people get on board, there will be an almost supernatural "tipping point" where bad ideas suddenly become good ideas.

You can see it with the "free market" cultists as an example. We've seen that the result of deregulation of the financial sector and weakening of oversight has led to a worldwide market crisis. What makes "free market" Capitalism a cult is that when faced with the fact that deregulation led directly to disaster, they answer that the problem was that there was any regulation at all. That flies in the face of any sane reading of the evidence, but that's where they are. They believe that even though cutting regulation in half makes things 10 times worse, at some point if you cut it far enough it creates a magical situation where things become better than they were when they were regulated.

The Communists had the same sort of script: if only we could make enough countries Communist, and weed out enough dissidents, the disaster of our system will reach a tipping point where it suddenly starts producing positive results. Anarchists are just dumb, and Venusians have their heads in the Star Trek clouds.

I have long since abandoned dealing with you since you LOVE to draw accusations without even any inquiry as to what the Venus Project is. First off allow me to give you something here; try looking into the Venus Project before you start making so many speculations and posting them as fact. Also, how many times must I say this, a Utopian society does not exist, it will never exist; it has never existed. Their is no such thing, what is this Utopian society you speak of because it does not compute. A better system is what it is; and what is Venusians your talking about? Sounds like a vegetable to me. When you categorize the Venus Project all you do is form incoherent gibbering arguments that always reak with inconsistent notions.

Have you ever talked with anyone inside the Venus Project? Watched the Seminar I provided? Talked with people within the Movement? Because you have not.

 

[IamtheVOICE123]

Ok, here's a tip of advice then: Before you post any claims on here, do the research first so you're not fumbling around for information midway through the topic.

I have a memory problem on specific subjects that I do not normally go into; and a lot of times I always fail to bookmark something so sue me; bad memory not my fault.

 

[lightbulbsun88]

I have a memory problem on specific subjects that I do not normally go into; and a lot of times I always fail to bookmark something so sue me; bad memory not my fault.

A bad memory is not an excuse for going into a discussion headlong.

 

[Anonymous]

IamtheVOICE123,

You've been warned once already, now you've earned yourself a temporary ban. Troll again and it will be permanent.

 

[GoodKat]

You need to look up Anarchy because it is a transitional period from something that is wanted, to something that is desired. Their is a film by a youtube called shanklinmike that has a video outlining this. Anyways, Anarchy has a central form of thought stating that "it's everyone for themselves." Try looking at the history or Russia.

According to webster my use of the word anarchy was fine, my point stands.

 

[Th1sWasATriumph]

I have a memory problem on specific subjects that I do not normally go into; and a lot of times I always fail to bookmark something so sue me; bad memory not my fault.

Look who came back after his dramatic exit . . . without referring to a single thing I said in response to him . . .

So whose fault is it? You're blaming us for not allowing you to gather your arguments when it is clearly your own responsibility, especially when you keep posting whilst complaining that we don't give you a chance to get your stuff together.

If you're that keenly aware of your own limitations, don't you think you should address them and start debates with them in mind?

I'm with Ree. This is blatant trolling. "You won't let me do my research BUT I CAN'T DO IT BECAUSE MY BRAIN WON'T WORK". I do my research on hitherto unfamiliar topics. You clearly can too, considering the amount of copypasta you've inflicted on us.

 

[IBSpify]

Ok, I admit first off that i have not done a lot of research into the Venus Project, but from the Discription that the now banned IamtheVOICE gave on the first page, it sounds like a bunch of trekkies trying to create the society from star trek, and well frankly that will never happen.

for the society such as the one he descibed to work you would have to eliminate peoples desire for money and power, which you would never be able to do, and frankly wouldn't want to do, greed is actually a very good motivator

 

[felixthecoach]

Greed and anxiety are probably the best motivators. ("O crap! My boss is watching I hope he doesnt fire me!")

 

[Synystyr]

To ignore the last 8 pages, its basically a pie in the sky idea that shouldn't even be pondered right now. There are better better ways to structure (or lack thereof), than the current one, but this is impractical in the short term and probably not as ideal as it sounds in reality..