The stupidest thing a creatonist has ever said to you

[ShootMyMonkey]

Here's a fun one. An IRC chat where a Muslim joined in, who I shall refer to as "Moron" Yes, this is the conversation log. I included the full context of the conversation in the channel, though I removed the occasional outside interjection of LOLs and such just to focus on this particular exchange

Me : I often use the example of Wayne Bent sleeping with his son's wife after pretending to have convulsions and getting a message from God, and then point to Muslims that Muhammad did the exact same thing and forced Zaid to divorce his wife and married her.
Moron : What are you talking about? Where do you get those lies about our prophet? Who is Zaid? Are you getting this from false hadeeths?
Me : Zaid is one adopted son of Muhammad, and Muhammad initially told him that he should stay married to his wife Zaynab, while apparently hiding his base desires for her, so then Allah apparently spoke to him once again and then told him that Zaid should divorce his wife and hand her over to Muhammad.
Moron : Your problem is that you are believing false hadeeths which lie about our holy prophet. That story never actually happened.
Me : No, I'm not talking about the hadiths. Although the hadith books of Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim both go into specific details (as do other historical records) about the story, it is mentioned in the Qur'an in Q33:37.
Moron : That verse doesn't say that Zaid was his adopted son. And even if it did, it's not like it says he was the prophet's real son, does it?
Me : So you're saying it's okay just because he wasn't his real son? And by the way, the Qur'an verse 33:37 very definitively states that the apparent reason that Allah inundated Muhammad with those feelings of lust towards Zaynab was so that taking her from Zaid would set the precedent of a man marrying his adopted son's ex-wife. Exactly how is it supposed to set a PRECEDENT for something if it wasn't an example of that very thing?
Moron : You can't just take the parts of the Qur'an that agree with your false hadeeths and interpret it through them. The Qur'an verse just says he took his wife because Allah made Muhammad want her, so the man finished his business with her, and then gave her up to the prophet, which all people should do.
Me : For crying out loud, it says it right there that it set a precedent. If it sets a precedent, then that means that it was an example of that. If that event is supposed to set a precedent for a man marrying his adopted son's ex-wife, then that means that Muhammad married his adopted son's ex-wife.
Moron : It says that, but it doesn't say that Zaid was Muhammad's adopted son. You're using your hadeeths.to interpret the words of the prophet just like you used it earlier to interpret my words.
Me : I'm not using the friggin' hadiths to interpret anything! I'm interpreting the meaning of those words through a goddamned dictionary! Y'know... the thing that defines you the meaning of words!!! The words in the friggin' Qur'an ON THEIR OWN effectively say that Zaid was Muhammad's adopted son. And while we're at it, what words of yours did I supposedly interpret through hadiths?
Moron : See, the difference with Muslims and all the fake people out there is that we only have the one book -- the Qur'an. It is the source of all things true. You rely on all sorts of other books and take them as fact instead. That makes you automatically wrong.
Me : What a pantload. Actual fact is factual independent of where it is mentioned, and by no means should any one book be the arbiter of truth. That's the reason why people who have functioning brains actually read stuff and actually go out and find out whether things are true.
Moron : Of course the Qur'an isn't the arbiter of truth. It's just that something can only be true if it has confirmation in the Qur'an.
Me : Po-tay-to, Po-tay-to. The internet on which you're typing this has no confirmation in the Qur'an. Does that mean it's not real?
Moron : Yes it does. The internet is completely fake because it was made by fake people who don't believe in the truth of Allah.
Me : o___O Except it's real in the sense that it is here and it exists, and you're using it right now.
Moron : No. Real means it is true, and truth is something that only Islam can offer. The internet doesn't exist in reality if it does not exist in the Qur'an. Only the Qur'an is true.
Me : You're using it right now. Moreover, you're not mentioned in the Qur'an, so does that mean you're not real either?
Moron : I live the Qur'an, which means I am in it. My life is through the Qur'an, and is thus confirmed by it. That makes me real. You and all atheists like you are not.
Me : So then why use the fake internet?
Moron : Through the efforts of true Muslims, we can make the internet real. Until then, it isn't actually there.
Me : How on earth do you make something that apparently isn't there real?
Moron : Insha'allah, it will be.
Me : That doesn't answer anything. So what if your god is willing?
Moron : Because you don't exist either, you cannot know.

It became pretty unbearable at that point. I really should have quit earlier, but I wondered how long the real thing could go on. I couldn't go on any longer without vomiting.

 

[Anachronous Rex]

Here's a fun one. An IRC chat where a Muslim joined in, who I shall refer to as "Moron" Yes, this is the conversation log. I included the full context of the conversation in the channel, though I removed the occasional outside interjection of LOLs and such just to focus on this particular exchange

Me : I often use the example of Wayne Bent sleeping with his son's wife after pretending to have convulsions and getting a message from God, and then point to Muslims that Muhammad did the exact same thing and forced Zaid to divorce his wife and married her.
Moron : What are you talking about? Where do you get those lies about our prophet? Who is Zaid? Are you getting this from false hadeeths?
Me : Zaid is one adopted son of Muhammad, and Muhammad initially told him that he should stay married to his wife Zaynab, while apparently hiding his base desires for her, so then Allah apparently spoke to him once again and then told him that Zaid should divorce his wife and hand her over to Muhammad.
Moron : Your problem is that you are believing false hadeeths which lie about our holy prophet. That story never actually happened.
Me : No, I'm not talking about the hadiths. Although the hadith books of Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Muslim both go into specific details (as do other historical records) about the story, it is mentioned in the Qur'an in Q33:37.
Moron : That verse doesn't say that Zaid was his adopted son. And even if it did, it's not like it says he was the prophet's real son, does it?
Me : So you're saying it's okay just because he wasn't his real son? And by the way, the Qur'an verse 33:37 very definitively states that the apparent reason that Allah inundated Muhammad with those feelings of lust towards Zaynab was so that taking her from Zaid would set the precedent of a man marrying his adopted son's ex-wife. Exactly how is it supposed to set a PRECEDENT for something if it wasn't an example of that very thing?
Moron : You can't just take the parts of the Qur'an that agree with your false hadeeths and interpret it through them. The Qur'an verse just says he took his wife because Allah made Muhammad want her, so the man finished his business with her, and then gave her up to the prophet, which all people should do.
Me : For crying out loud, it says it right there that it set a precedent. If it sets a precedent, then that means that it was an example of that. If that event is supposed to set a precedent for a man marrying his adopted son's ex-wife, then that means that Muhammad married his adopted son's ex-wife.
Moron : It says that, but it doesn't say that Zaid was Muhammad's adopted son. You're using your hadeeths.to interpret the words of the prophet just like you used it earlier to interpret my words.
Me : I'm not using the friggin' hadiths to interpret anything! I'm interpreting the meaning of those words through a goddamned dictionary! Y'know... the thing that defines you the meaning of words!!! The words in the friggin' Qur'an ON THEIR OWN effectively say that Zaid was Muhammad's adopted son. And while we're at it, what words of yours did I supposedly interpret through hadiths?
Moron : See, the difference with Muslims and all the fake people out there is that we only have the one book -- the Qur'an. It is the source of all things true. You rely on all sorts of other books and take them as fact instead. That makes you automatically wrong.
Me : What a pantload. Actual fact is factual independent of where it is mentioned, and by no means should any one book be the arbiter of truth. That's the reason why people who have functioning brains actually read stuff and actually go out and find out whether things are true.
Moron : Of course the Qur'an isn't the arbiter of truth. It's just that something can only be true if it has confirmation in the Qur'an.
Me : Po-tay-to, Po-tay-to. The internet on which you're typing this has no confirmation in the Qur'an. Does that mean it's not real?
Moron : Yes it does. The internet is completely fake because it was made by fake people who don't believe in the truth of Allah.
Me : o___O Except it's real in the sense that it is here and it exists, and you're using it right now.
Moron : No. Real means it is true, and truth is something that only Islam can offer. The internet doesn't exist in reality if it does not exist in the Qur'an. Only the Qur'an is true.
Me : You're using it right now. Moreover, you're not mentioned in the Qur'an, so does that mean you're not real either?
Moron : I live the Qur'an, which means I am in it. My life is through the Qur'an, and is thus confirmed by it. That makes me real. You and all atheists like you are not.
Me : So then why use the fake internet?
Moron : Through the efforts of true Muslims, we can make the internet real. Until then, it isn't actually there.
Me : How on earth do you make something that apparently isn't there real?
Moron : Insha'allah, it will be.
Me : That doesn't answer anything. So what if your god is willing?
Moron : Because you don't exist either, you cannot know.

It became pretty unbearable at that point. I really should have quit earlier, but I wondered how long the real thing could go on. I couldn't go on any longer without vomiting.

Interesting philosophy. I guess he wouldn't mind then if your unreal foot were shoved up his arse?

 

[ShootMyMonkey]

Interesting philosophy. I guess he wouldn't mind then if your unreal foot were shoved up his arse?

The last time I heard a person say that anything which isn't in the Qur'an is untrue, it resulted in the following --

 

[DeathofSpeech]

"YOU MUST ACCEPT JESUS AS YOUR SAVIOR OR YOU BURN IN ETERNAL HELLFIRE...

God Bless You"
:facepalm:

 

[FaithlessThinker]

"YOU MUST ACCEPT JESUS AS YOUR SAVIOR OR YOU BURN IN ETERNAL HELLFIRE...

God Bless You"
:facepalm:

Next time he says that, just reply:
"YOU MUST RECITE THE SHAHADA AND SUBMIT TO ALLAH OR YOU'LL BURN IN ETERNAL HELLFIRE...

Asalamu alaikum"

 

[Mithcoriel]

"Ok, I understand what you are saying but my Grandfather just died and you can't tell me there is no god because I miss him too much"

I actually understand that one. It's basically like saying "You don't need to remind me of my grief right now". Trying to convince her right now that she's grieving, that heaven doesn't exist, is like saying: "Your grandfather is dead, remember? And you'll never see him again. He's so dead, so totally dead, in case you'd forgotten.."

Here's a fun one. An IRC chat where a Muslim joined in, who I shall refer to as "Moron" Yes, this is the conversation log. I included the full context of the conversation in the channel, though I removed the occasional outside interjection of LOLs and such just to focus on this particular exchange

...

Nice Pwnage. But why did you argue around so much on the fact that the guy is Mohammed's son, instead of on the fact that it's immoral either way?

Anyway, that guy is so weird. He automatically assumes you've got fake hadeeths the moment you say something unpleasant. Where the heck do all those fake hadeeths come from, does he think? Wouldn't a more normal reaction be: "What the..where did you get this information from? I'm sure it wasn't from a muslim writing?" It's like he's already been brought up with the belief that there's fake hadeeths all over the place.

 

[Anachronous Rex]

But real logic has nothing to do with math. Real math has little to do with logic. And neither has anything to do with intelligence.

 

[lrkun]

Theist:

If you pray, God will answer your prayers. It may not be tomorrow, next week, next month, or next year, but eventually it will be granted. I prayed for something and God granted it to me after 6 years.

Me:

...

(in my mind: If only you worked, instead of praying for that thing, you could have received it earlier.)

 

[Nautyskin]

"When you learn how to speak to a person's conscience, and circumnavigate the intellect, the subject of evolution seems to disappear." - Kirk Cameron.

It wasn't said to me, but it's got to rate a mention in a thread such as this.

 

[ShootMyMonkey]

Nice Pwnage. But why did you argue around so much on the fact that the guy is Mohammed's son, instead of on the fact that it's immoral either way?

I suppose one part of it was just getting caught up in the moment where he kept trying to deny over and over that the Qur'an actually said what it said. I did try to lead down the point of "how does that make it okay just because he's not his biological son?", but he didn't seem to bite that hook at all and kept saying I had false hadeeths about the adopted son relationship.

In any case, immoral as it might have been otherwise, marrying someone else's ex-wife doesn't necessarily strike us as all that immoral when it's not someone with whom the person is close. We do tend to feel more remorse if we sleep with our best friend's ex-girlfriend than when we sleep with a total stranger's ex-girlfriend, after all. I suppose I could have gotten on the whole point of how the Qur'an refers to the preceding divorce from Zaid as taking place "after Zaid had finished with" his wife, as if to suggest that a wife is basically a tool to satisfy some measurable purpose, but that can very easily be interpreted in a number of ways. Besides which, I started off on drawing the parallel to how easy it was to tell than Wayne Bent was faking that he got a message from God when he simply wanted to bone his son's wife, and compared it to the story of Mohammed wanting to bone Zaid's wife where he did quite literally the identical act.

Anyway, that guy is so weird. He automatically assumes you've got fake hadeeths the moment you say something unpleasant. Where the heck do all those fake hadeeths come from, does he think? Wouldn't a more normal reaction be: "What the..where did you get this information from? I'm sure it wasn't from a muslim writing?" It's like he's already been brought up with the belief that there's fake hadeeths all over the place.

He apparently does. There had been later discussions where other people got him to at least say that he believes that several hadeeths had been modified and falsified later on by twisted Saudi Bedouins. Apparently, the only hadeeths which are true are the ones which actually agree with what the Qur'an says. What's funny is that this was a case where the Sunni hadeeths actually DO agree with the Qur'an. But because it paints the prophet in a negative light, it's automatically fake. It's an easy accusation to fall back on, I guess, which makes it true.

 

[DeathofSpeech]

But real logic has nothing to do with math. Real math has little to do with logic. And neither has anything to do with intelligence.

I respond to the "logic and math don't have anything to do with the real world etc." with apples.

I me
I have mate and child
I need apples to feed
me+mate+child
hunger+hunger+hunger = 1+1+1=3
I have 3 hunger
I need
Apple+apple+apple = 1+1+1=3
I need 3 apple

IF I have 3 apples, I have enough apples

A chimp can do this without difficulty

 

[DeathofSpeech]

The very fact we're discussing things shows the total lunacy of naturalism.

...he typed on his computer, in his air conditioned home, with float-glass windows, and refrigerator and lighting that use electrical current... and a new species of corn in the corn chips he munches while sitting and babbling about how naturalism ruins all the good things about life.

 

[australopithecus]

An add on Facebook clearly stating the obvious that creatards are either dishonest or ignorant and will go out of their way to make everyone just as ignorant as them.

 

[ShootMyMonkey]

A link I ran across on FSTDT. It's just downright indecipherable for one, but it's all kinds of hilarious for that reason. The guy has a rather humorous preoccupation with feces.

http://tos100.wordpress.com/2010/07/28/repent-fagot-from-energycrisis13-the-real-messiah/

 

[ThetaOmega]

A link I ran across on FSTDT. It's just downright indecipherable for one, but it's all kinds of hilarious for that reason. The guy has a rather humorous preoccupation with feces.

http://tos100.wordpress.com/2010/07/28/repent-fagot-from-energycrisis13-the-real-messiah/

Gah... why can these people produce such BS in such vast quantities?

 

[FaithlessThinker]

Gah... why can these people produce such BS in such vast quantities?

Indigestion of scientific facts. Also possible: malnutrition of knowledge.

 

[Nautyskin]

An add on Facebook clearly stating the obvious that creatards are either dishonest or ignorant and will go out of their way to make everyone just as ignorant as them.

Wow, that's a shocker!

 

[lrkun]

Let's bless your new car.

 

[Pulsar]

Let's bless your new car.

That's common in the catholic Church. One day a year, the priest blesses the vehicles of his parishers (including the bikes).

 

[Nautyskin]

Let's bless your new car.

That's common in the catholic Church. One day a year, the priest blesses the vehicles of his parishers (including the bikes).

Are you fucking kidding me, man? What in the fuck ...