Priority Shift

[ThePuppyTurtle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKUbTOqFoNk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lkZEb6uO3E&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGPwBRGOsDw&lc=5kh1u9DmCw4PdxIz1_8E2MT_FRo-k-zlPxTTSK09z-8&feature=inbox

Discuss, Please watch all vids first.

 

[Master_Ghost_Knight]

GRAB THE LEDGE GRAB THE LEDGE!!!! To late.

This words will seam confusing at the moment but I have a feeling you will realise the meaning of this some point in the future.
Just trust me when I say it is all ok.

 

[lrkun]

Discuss, Please watch all of both vids first.

You have all this time to make a youtube videos? How's your studies? Do you do part time work? Do you have a bank account where you can save money? Do you go to school?

Simply? What's your priority in life?

 

[ThePuppyTurtle]

Discuss, Please watch all of both vids first.

You have all this time to make a youtube videos? How's your studies? Do you do part time work? Do you have a bank account where you can save money? Do you go to school?

Simply? What's your priority in life?

I get off at 3:00

 

[lrkun]

I get off at 3:00

From bed? The above doesn't really give an answer. Can you be more specific?

 

[nasher168]

I am impressed. I am very impressed.
Simply believing evolution happens does not make you inherently likely to become atheistic. As an example, just about the entire Christian population of the UK believe in evolution. Only in the US, of all the western democracies, is creationism so powerful.

Kudos in the second video for explicitly admitting a lack of knowledge. It is a very important admission and one that people should always be willing to make. Questioning is a virtue and the more you question, the more you learn.

Science is definitely a worthy field. Bear in mind, however, that it isn't as glamorous as you might think. Marine Biology (the field I am myself particularly interested in going in to) in particular is I think notoriously misleading in its public image. The traditional image is that of cool people going to tropical islands and tagging manta rays. While this does happen on occasion to some of them, a marine biologist is also highly likely to end up doing a lot of tedious counting and analysing of figures.
That isn't to say that there aren't exciting aspects of biology and it certainly isn't to discourage you, but there are also boring parts to be endured.

I get off at 3:00

From bed? The above doesn't really give an answer. Can you be more specific?

From school. :facepalm:

 

[he_who_is_nobody]

Well, what do we have here?

A creationist realizing the limitations of his knowledge and, seeming to, conduct real research into the subject of evolution. This is amazing news!

ThePuppyTurtle, throughout both videos you state that you realize that you do not know much. The fact that you are able to see and admit this will make you a far better scientist in the future. That ability is something that escapes people like shockofgod and NephilimFree. They are people who believe they are never wrong, when anyone with a basic understanding of just about any subject can show them to be wrong. Being unbiased when conducting research will take you along way in understanding the world around you. You will see that the world is far more beautiful and amazing when seen through the lens of reality.

I also just want to point out that most of the people in the U.S. that accept evolution are Christian. They are not mutually exclusive ideas. In fact, I accepted evolution and believed in Christianity when I was younger. My conversion to being an atheist had very little to do with my understanding of evolution. Just remember that evolution is science, science comments on the natural world. A god(s) would be supernatural, therefore evolution cannot comment on a god(s).

I am glad that you are trying to take an unbiased approach to studying this subject, something I was advocating back in this thread. I truly believe that if your faith is strong enough, nothing about the theory of evolution can shake it, no more than the theory of gravity can shake it.

 

[lrkun]

From school. :facepalm:

He didn't specify.

@pup

Keep studying. Hopefully, through studying well, you'll find what you're looking for.

 

[nasher168]

[
He didn't specify.

But it was kind of... obvious :|

 

[lrkun]

[
He didn't specify.

But it was kind of... obvious :|

I don't assume and it wasn't obvious. ^,^

 

[ThePuppyTurtle]

I am impressed. I am very impressed.
Simply believing evolution happens does not make you inherently likely to become atheistic. As an example, just about the entire Christian population of the UK believe in evolution. Only in the US, of all the western democracies, is creationism so powerful.

Kudos in the second video for explicitly admitting a lack of knowledge. It is a very important admission and one that people should always be willing to make. Questioning is a virtue and the more you question, the more you learn.

Science is definitely a worthy field. Bear in mind, however, that it isn't as glamorous as you might think. Marine Biology (the field I am myself particularly interested in going in to) in particular is I think notoriously misleading in its public image. The traditional image is that of cool people going to tropical islands and tagging manta rays. While this does happen on occasion to some of them, a marine biologist is also highly likely to end up doing a lot of tedious counting and analysing of figures.
That isn't to say that there aren't exciting aspects of biology and it certainly isn't to discourage you, but there are also boring parts to be endured.

Sea life is fascinating and mysterious, I want to know as much as I can about it and I'd hope that the people of the future will know more then I can ever dream to in this Life.

 

[borrofburi]

Simply believing evolution happens does not make you inherently likely to become atheistic. As an example, just about the entire Christian population of the UK believe in evolution. Only in the US, of all the western democracies, is creationism so powerful.

Meh. I'm going to take the opposite view: creationism was what killed (or at least started to kill) my christian-ness. After taking AP Bio it became clear that not only were all creationist arguments weak, not only were they almost always rooted in a failure to understand, but they were almost always spoken by someone with absolute certainty. This lead to a very simple dichotomy: either the person was completely ignorant yet completely confident (and why should I trust such a person?), or the person knew that what they were saying was wrong and was deliberately lying. Either way, I couldn't trust the loud assertive creationists... But then a frightening thing happened: I started to notice that all my religious leaders were confident creationists... And really, if I had been so very deceived by creationists all my life, what else might I have been deceived by?

So I started a process of investigation: which of my beliefs, if any, were based in evidence? I've sort of approximately finished that (though the remaining things are probably so ingrained I can't even realize they could be questioned; about a year ago my girlfriend caused me to question one of those, it was kind of weird because I didn't know I had any left); now what remains is making sure my beliefs remain based in evidence, and revising my beliefs should new evidence be brought to my attention, as well as seeking new evidence, especially for things I already know I understand poorly (like my entire professional field ).

Knowing the science and being confronted by creationists was one of the major threads that got pulled to unravel my beliefs.

 

[nasher168]

Simply believing evolution happens does not make you inherently likely to become atheistic. As an example, just about the entire Christian population of the UK believe in evolution. Only in the US, of all the western democracies, is creationism so powerful.

Meh. I'm going to take the opposite view: creationism was what killed (or at least started to kill) my christian-ness.

In fairness, I think that's precisely what happened to FearMonger. Came onto these boards, got pwnd, pledged to take a more evidence-based standpoint and came back a couple of weeks later as an atheist.

Even so, evolution and science in general is not usually mutually exclusive to Christianity.

 

[Squawk]

I've always contended that the natural resting place for a converted creationist is atheist, because a creationist would presumably see the moderate stance as idiotic while creationist, and nothing that they learned while investigating the claims made by religion would shake that position.

The falsity is the statement that one cannot believe in evolution and still be religious. It's certainly possible, I did it, many here did it, lots of biologists still do it. But I doubt you can find me more than a handful of creationist converts who are now moderate.

Borro, I wonder on a regular basis what assumptions are still at work in my worldview. When I find them, I analyse them, but it's damn hard to spot them unaided.

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

I'm impressed about how you admit that you don't know everything ... That is the first step to knowing anything.

Now, you must recognize the wonders of peer-review, and why it is so important to the Scientific Method.

 

[Memeticemetic]

Sea life is fascinating and mysterious, I want to know as much as I can about it and I'd hope that the people of the future will know more then I can ever dream to in this Life.

Of that there is little doubt. That's what rocks about science in general. There's so much we don't know, and so much we're on the cusp of discovering.

I was overjoyed to watch your videos. I admire the courage that it takes to truly examine your beliefs and challenge them; especially in the light of the fact that you so vociferously espoused the beliefs being challenged in a public forum. This is a courage many of those you may admire now lack. You are showing yourself the better man. Well done, my friend.

 

[australopithecus]

I think Operation Ivy said it best in the song 'Knowledge'; all I know is that I don't know.

Admitting you have much to learn in the first step in the learning process.

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

I think Operation Ivy said it best in the song 'Knowledge'; all I know is that I don't know.

Admitting you have much to learn in the first step in the learning process.

I was chilling in Shock's chat, and they started talking about Puppy.
Not to say I was suprised, but with news that Puppy said that he's actually going to look at this unbiased, and with the admission that he doesn't know everything in the entire world, they started saying that we were trying to convert him and called him a strong-headed child.
>.>
I'm not shocked more than I am disgusted at the knowledge that people will love you whenever you are ignorant and think you know it all (like they are) but the second someone starts actually thinking, they will go off and talk behind their back.


Puppy -
I must warn you. As your Bible says, fools hate knowledge and wisdom. I have no doubt that you will research this thoroughly, and (hopefully) through peer-reviewed sources. Simply note the responses from us here, versus those in Shock's chatroom. If you notice, during this entire thread we have stayed on topic, and spoken highly of you - simply for admitting that you don't know everything, and for (at the very least) attempting to research things on your own. We have not spoken of your religion, your faith, or anything else.
Now note what is about to change. Once you stop taking Nephy for his word, and looking to peer-reviewed sources outside of his reccomendation, the niceties will stop and the condescinding ad hominems will shine through.
I bet you every dollar I made this past year on deployment that the second you say something that counters what he says, and hold through to the topics and the facts on the matter, you will become public enemy #1 to him.

That said, this is a place where we will not always agree with you - but no one (aside from trolls) are considered "enemies."Tthe mocking only lasts for as long as bias, mockery, and stupidity does (or where it just derails into pissing contests), and not into perpetual roundabouts of boring nonsense, which religion was right, conspiracy theories, and poorly-defined dictionary semantics. It's a large number of people with different ideas, opinions, fields, and stretches of belief that come here for intellectual exchange, witty banter, and a few times to cross swords in the debate arena to refine what we know. And, really, the best moderators known to man.

BTW, I never posted in your "Introduction" Thread. Welcome, Puppy, to the LeagueOfReason.

 

[Squawk]

And, really, the best moderators known to man.

Giggity.

Though to echo those sentiments, ask youself a simple question. Which side is asking you, constantly, to be open minded, to follow the evidence, and to draw conclusions based on that evidence, without bias? Which side is telling you that they are correct and simply follow them?

Meh, sides, it's like a football team.

I don't care if you disagree with me, but I do care about the method you used to arrive at conclusions which differ from my own.

 

[australopithecus]

I don't care if you disagree with me, but I do care about the method you used to arrive at conclusions which differ from my own.

This.

If Neph and Shock has critically and objectively looked at the evidence and decided they were unconvinced then (despite my confusion) I'd have to accept that. They didn't. They decided they were right and went about confirming their own bias. The fact that Puppy has admitted he doesn't know means he is already years ahead of them in maturity.