My Teachers Are All Creationists

[Chirios]

I go to a college in East London. Because of the relative crappiness of London secondary (high) schools; colleges in East London are also relatively crappy. This leads to pretty much anyone being able to teach at college level, regardless of their experience or skill. Still, I was quite surprised to find out that in my college, my biology, chemistry, and physics teachers either do not believe in evolution, or are creationists. To quote my physics teacher:

"I have done a lot of research [on evolution], and scientists have never found one basic kind of thing turning into another."

*facepalm*

The thing is, while they're okay people, they're also really bad teachers, and I wonder if this may have something to do with it. I don't think they understand what they are teaching, so much as simply recite from the textbook.

 

[Epicion]

My biology teacher is a creationist...I kinda feel the same way as you. Btw I live near Reading.

It's awkward when this same teacher reads about transitional forms and fossils and yet 5 minutes later says he does not believe in it. It kinda makes me feel the person who is portraying the message themselves do not believe in it ..but I don't want to fail my exams so meh

-Am

 

[Ozymandyus]

Wow... If my teachers had spewed such bullshit I would have asked them questions and rubbed their faces in their own stupidity whenever possible. As long as you are a good student, they have no choice but to take it.

 

[GoodKat]

I would probably be challenging them at every opportunity.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

My advice? Change classes or keep your head down. Unless their foolish beliefs keep them from teaching the material, it might be better to just let it go. Complain AFTER you're out of the class. Or, in the case of some schools, complain and get others to complain on the anonymous teacher evaluations.

 

[Ozymandyus]

Yeah, now that I noticed that you are in college its a better idea to keep your ideas to yourself probably. College teachers aren't nearly as accountable and can grade you harshly even if you are a good student.. at least that was my experience in the U.S.

I would be tempted to ask them why they think that... have an honest debate with them. I most certainly would think about talking privately to the department heads and ask them what THEY think about it.

 

[PJDesseyn]

Yes, from own experience, I can say: don't engage them. No matter how wrong they are, don't engage them. Tell a contact person or someone that stands between teachers and students to try and get an agreement, but by all means, don't engage the teachers yourself. Certainly not if the teacher in question is practically worshipping him/herself.

 

[Canto]

If that was the case here in the states at a public university, I'd be breaking out the legal team. They don't get to teach their religiously biased views here no matter how they phrase them.

 

[Spase]

In fairness a physics teacher or even a chemist is required little enough biology training it's conceivable that they don't understand evolution.

Biology teachers failing so thoroughly is disgraceful.

In college I'd just ignore it in any teacher that wasn't supposed to be teaching me about evolution-related concepts... unless they actually started making statements like "There's no evidence for evolution."

The fact that the physicist used the term "kind" is so damn biblical is hurts. His claims of "research" are as valid as a biologist telling him that he (the biologist) has done a lot of research and found that current theories of galaxy formation are wrong. For some odd reason it seems common for people to think they're qualified to discuss biology without studying it... while other sciences don't get this so often.

Am I wrong? Can someone from another field give examples of people with a shaky high school education claiming to know more about an area of a field than the experts? I'm honestly curious.

 

[Otokogoroshi]

I'm a stubborn bastard. If I was going to a school with idiots like that teaching me I would be screaming to the high heavens about it. I would complain to everyone who listened and if the gave me a bad grade despite my doing all the work passing on the tests I would scream even louder.

But this is just me. I'm usually willing to take hits.

 

[GoodKat]

Am I wrong? Can someone from another field give examples of people with a shaky high school education claiming to know more about an area of a field than the experts? I'm honestly curious.

It happens basically in every field that is in conflict with any sort of religious or superstitious belief.

 

[Ozymandyus]

Am I wrong? Can someone from another field give examples of people with a shaky high school education claiming to know more about an area of a field than the experts? I'm honestly curious.

Well, I only have a biology minor, but yes I think biology gets this a bit more than the other sciences.

Part of the problem is that the curriculum for highschool biology (which ends up being many people's last biology course) asks us to teach far more rote memorization rather than complicated theories or the big pictures of more complex biological systems. We only teach the relatively simple systems like the carbon cycle and nitrogen cycle and the very basic principles of evolution. I think we would teach more of the interesting and complex biological theory if it didn't offend some people because it HAS to put humans on the same level with animals. Sadly some people still can't accept this concept on ideological grounds. Since people are often not taught complex and difficult biology theory, biology seems quite simple and approachable to everyone.

The other scientists don't run into these sorts of ideological barriers, or at least not often, and so they can teach more abstract theory and thus seem more inaccessible and hard to understand.

Thats my guess anyway. Also, of course, we all are living creatures and a large amount of biology is observable macroscopically and thus also makes it seem approachable.

 

[Spase]

It happens basically in every field that is in conflict with any sort of religious or superstitious belief.

Fair enough. I just want to see someone claim that Newton's laws of motion are wrong because they're used to show how the universe is expanding from a single point giving evidence of the big bang. I'm not arguing with it.. I just want to see it because it's so utterly ludicrous.

Part of the problem is that the curriculum for highschool biology (which ends up being many people's last biology course) asks us to teach far more rote memorization rather than complicated theories or the big pictures of more complex biological systems. We only teach the relatively simple systems like the carbon cycle and nitrogen cycle and the very basic principles of evolution.

I think you make a good point here. I've had very little exposure to the rote memorization side of biology because I never went to highschool.

I was lucky enough that my first class that really touched on macro biological concepts (as opposed to molecular) was given by a teacher who refused to teach the classification system of species, family, genus, etc. His reasoning was that phylogeny is something that's being quickly defined by the molecular evidence that's now available which gives us much better information about the way species branched and when.

There's some truth to the claim that biology was just stamp collecting before genetics revolutionized the field. People went out and collected and cataloged. That's changed a lot but I think too many people are still living in the past. I think as biology as a field becomes better represented in high schools it will have more respect.

 

[Chirios]

In fairness a physics teacher or even a chemist is required little enough biology training it's conceivable that they don't understand evolution.

Biology teachers failing so thoroughly is disgraceful.

Biology Teacher: If you don't believe in evolution, you still need to learn it for the exam.

Me: Do you "believe" in evolution sir?

Biology Teacher: no, there's no evidence for it.

 

[Spase]

*vomits in disgust*

Seriously. If you have your teacher's email I'll email them piles of evidence over the weekend. Hopefully they have enough background education to understand the evidence....

 

[Master_Ghost_Knight]

I generaly use a good rule of thumb that you should doubt some ones credentials if he expouses blatant errors on the field. And generaly hapens that they don't have the degree at all, (it also hapens that a person has lost 30% of the brain in an acident as exemplified on a topic in the pseudo-science section)

 

[australopithecus]

Biology Teacher: If you don't believe in evolution, you still need to learn it for the exam.

Me: Do you "believe" in evolution sir?

Biology Teacher: no, there's no evidence for it.

I don't know why but it still shocks me that this happens in the UK. The US is supposed to have all the religious nutjobs, not us.

 

[Mapp]

As a teacher myself I would disagree with some of the posts here. Engage them, but engage them on every level so as to guarantee they won't sabotage your grades based on your viewpoints. Some teachers are, of course, intellectually honest enough to be able to take an opposing viewpoint from a student and have enough respect for them to not ding their grade. Others of course, take petty revenge wherever possible. As everyone who has been on Youtube for the last year can attest, Creationists tend to fall into the latter camp. Call them out for their embarrassing stupidity in class with verified scientific facts, prove that you're doing extra-curricular research to back it up (cite peer reviewed research for example.) Also demand all your work back promptly, with both the grades themselves, and the standards by which papers are graded. If the grade you got doesn't match the standard parameters, confront them during office hours or after school.

If they get belligerent, defensive or vindictive, then with documentary evidence of their malpractice in hand, contact the principle, and school board simultaneously, as well as outside help from organizations dedicated to real science education. In the United States you can call the National Center for Science Education, they work pro-bono on cases like that. In the U.K. you could try Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science. One thing school officials hate, is big guns breathing down their necks, because they tend to attract the press.

This is of course, the nuclear option, and you have to decide how far you're willing to go. But I think naming and shaming those responsible for polluting the minds of children is one of the greatest tasks we can carry out. Just remember to always proceed legally, and with a well documented paper trail to back yourself up. As always, the IDiots will buckle under the oversight of an objective inquiry.

 

[MachineSp1rit]

i agree with almost all posts here.

do not engage them, i mean all people generally, on this particular subject of course, i usually evade arguing about this, since it is 100% pointless and even harmful for u, but sometimes words fly out of my mouth or i say some cynical phrase towards their pointless views, but my teachers are ok with this things here, most of them keep their ideas for themselves, and most do not reject evolution. so i dont have that problem fortunately.

as for engaging teachers in general, well, if the teacher is relatively smart and not too stupidly "overprincipal" u can disagree on certain things, that will make him think (and even better if thats true) that his students are interested in what he is saying. but dont do this too often, especially with somebody dumb u dont want to mess with, as a result they will ignore ur questions, will not give u good marks (unless u know ur stuff really good), will treat u badly, i mean, if there is something to be done, like "go bring that chair over here" or "go and tell this guy in this class to come here"

 

[Master_Ghost_Knight]

If you haven't talked to your parents yet, then press them to act.
I think that also some else olde enough and that happens to live near him should pull some strings and help the chap. Contact the proper autoritys and press the educational direction.