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UK Christians arrested and charged for criticizing Islam

M

Mafiaaffe

New Member
arg-fallbackName="Mafiaaffe"/>
Read the articles:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1214666/Christian-hotel-owners-hauled-court-defending-beliefs-discussion-Muslim-guest.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/6209687/Christian-hoteliers-charged-with-insulting-Muslim-guest.html
 
arg-fallbackName="nasher168"/>
Arrrgh! Who do I back?
The christians sound like they were being bigots, and yet they should be free to criticise Islam. In addition to that, Islam is itself a barbaric religion (although many muslims are decent people) and deserves criticism. The Christian man said that Mohammed was a warlord. That is a historical fact. If they don't like it, that's their problem. The fact is that Mohammed led his people through conquest to becoming the largest power in the world in just 30 years.
Also, I doubt that the Christians would have pressed charges like the Muslims have if the Muslims had attacked Christianity so viciously (which, for all I know, they did). Christians (in my experience, on and off the internet) simply don't care that much, but Muslims seem to go berserk at the slightest mention of criticism.

So all in all, I think I back the christians here.
 
arg-fallbackName="Marcus"/>
It's not hard at all to see whom to back. This is a freedom of speech issue. The law being used against them is one intended to prevent speech which is a threat to public order, which this was patently not. Regardless of their motivations, these people should be free to criticise Islam as much as they like.
 
arg-fallbackName="Fullmetalgeneticist"/>
Only if muslims were free to criticise christians as much as they like... They Jailed Abu Hamza for anti western hate speech so to be fair these guys should join him. It is a fundie fight. Honestly the simplest thing to do is just not pay attention to them in the hopes they will go away.
 
arg-fallbackName="JacobEvans"/>
Fullmetalgeneticist said:
Only if muslims were free to criticise christians as much as they like... They Jailed Abu Hamza for anti western hate speech so to be fair these guys should join him. It is a fundie fight. Honestly the simplest thing to do is just not pay attention to them in the hopes they will go away.
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two wrongs make a right now?
 
arg-fallbackName="borrofburi"/>
Marcus said:
It's not hard at all to see whom to back. This is a freedom of speech issue. The law being used against them is one intended to prevent speech which is a threat to public order, which this was patently not. Regardless of their motivations, these people should be free to criticise Islam as much as they like.
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This.
 
arg-fallbackName="Icefire9atla"/>
Obviously, I'm on the Christian's side.

Everyone should be able to defend their beleifs and criticise other's beleifs. If that right is taken away, where would that lead us skeptics? Apparently with a huge fine and criminal record every time we try to criticise a religion.
 
arg-fallbackName="Aught3"/>
Maybe this will help christians understand why blasphemy laws are a bad idea.
 
arg-fallbackName="Wainscotting"/>
I'm in favour of anti-hate speech legislation, but people must be able to make their opinion heard without fear of the law.

The Muslims could have simply walked away and refused to pay the bill. And they would have been right to do it. If you're offended by something, be offended. But offensiveness should not be censured - not ever.
 
arg-fallbackName="nasher168"/>
I'm in favour of anti-hate speech legislation, but people must be able to make their opinion heard without fear of the law.
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But where do we draw the line? These people were alright in saying what they did about Muhammed, but if they had said something like "raghead" or "muzzy" then they would, in my opinion, have crossed the line.
 
arg-fallbackName="Aught3"/>
nasher168 said:
but if they had said something like "raghead" or "muzzy" then they would, in my opinion, have crossed the line.
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Why do you think this would cross the line? This seems just to cause offense, like criticising the religion.
 
arg-fallbackName="nasher168"/>
Aught3 said:
nasher168 said:
but if they had said something like "raghead" or "muzzy" then they would, in my opinion, have crossed the line.
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Why do you think this would cross the line? This seems just to cause offense, like criticising the religion.
Click to expand...

To me, it seems that in using terms like "muzzy" they are attacking the person, rather than their beliefs.
 
arg-fallbackName="Nick"/>
It will be a very sad day for UK and for free speech if they are convicted. It is also extremely worrying that Muslims seem to be given this very special treatment by the law in this country (UK). I can hardly see anyone having been arrested if comments about Jesus and Christian practice were made by a Muslim.

Hopefully this is a case of police incompetence that gets thrown aside by the courts but free speech seems to be an almost diminished value in the UK .
 
arg-fallbackName="Nick"/>
Aught3 said:
So is calling someone an idiot or stupid also crossing the line?
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Quite simply, well said.

None of us want to people to be coming up to us and saying offensive things but most of us don't want a law against it either. Who in their right mind would be in favour of passing a law against calling someone an idiot?
 
arg-fallbackName="MRaverz"/>
Nick said:
It will be a very sad day for UK and for free speech if they are convicted. It is also extremely worrying that Muslims seem to be given this very special treatment by the law in this country (UK). I can hardly see anyone having been arrested if comments about Jesus and Christian practice were made by a Muslim.

Hopefully this is a case of police incompetence that gets thrown aside by the courts but free speech seems to be an almost diminished value in the UK .
Click to expand...

This is nothing to do with freedom of speech as it seems to be as if the couple were being genuinely offensive, probably due to a lack of knowledge of their behalf. Therefore it's harassment, an abuse of freedom of expression. I hate how racist bigots feel they can hide behind freedom of speech as an excuse to go around insulting people who they disagree with. If you actually look at what the human rights act says, it states that you cannot abuse freedom of expression - i.e. using it to plainly insult or harass others.

I would welcome the couple to be fined and charged, in fact I really hope they are.


Additionally, you say that if a Muslim had have said the same about a Christian couple they would not have been arrested. This is simply untrue and you're quite ignorant to suggest that the police force and state could be so prejudice. In truth, you'll find that there are a lot more Christian bigots in the UK than Muslim bigots and this is highly understandable - for example, you won't see a flood of skinheads emigrating to Pakistan any time soon.
 
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