the latest religious uproar on youtube

[nemesiss]

i "found" this video on youtube, due to my subscription to TruePooka

in this video muslim "stone" (throwing bottles and stuff) at christians with really big signs and camera's.
not to be out done, the other party posts a video of what happened prior to this event...

your thoughts on this clash between religions?




[Youtube]XZT3ruR8GPQ[[/Youtube]

my thoughts: this to me proofs that both religions are unable to deliver humanity true peace and salvation.

 

[Laurens]

I'd say personally that the Christians are to blame in this instance, because it seems as though they went there to rile up a bunch of Muslims in order to provoke a reaction so they could film it and then cry "they're persecuting us!". Perhaps the reaction of the Muslims was misjudged, however I'd say that they were justifiably pissed off, and I'm glad it has backfired for the Christians by the footage of the prior events being released.

 

[tuxbox]

Christians acting un-Christ like, I am shocked!!!

 

[Dogma's Demise]

Ruben Israel (the fundie Christian preacher) is a major cunt, but he's within his 1st amendment rights. Throwing stuff at people is not, it's assault.

That reaction was uncalled for. I know a lot of them are kids so I won't be too harsh on them, but their parents have a lot to answer for. This is the kind of education they give to them?

Look, there was an atheist gathering in Australia a while ago and a Muslim group came shouting provocative statements like "Atheism is the CANCER", "Hitchens burn in hell" and "Atheism a humiliation of reason". (And let's be clear, they also have a right to say that. This is not like Choudary's protest instigating genocide and nuclear war against UK and Denmark. They're simply stating their dislike for atheism.) Did this warrant throwing objects at them? Of course not, and nobody did.

 

[nudger1964]

perhaps there is a difference between a gathering for a conference and a street festival?

This is just an example of a bunch of tossers trying their very best to antagonize another group of people - it could have been about any number of causes or principles, or even about what soccer team you support. This just happened to be of religious motives.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

Let's not start shifting responsibilities here.

Ruben Israel may very well intend to exploit his free speech rights knowing this might provoke an illegal response. That doesn't excuse you from your obligation to restrain yourself, and the best way to make him look even more ridiculous than he is already is to not react violently.

I mean just imagine the humiliation if you're trying to portray a group as violent and nobody reacts violently. :lol:

 

[nudger1964]

Im not shifting responsibilities,
I just fail to see that it says anything in particular about any religion, or that your link to the Atheist convention has anything to say about people of no religion.

 

[IBSpify]

While i do not condone the actions of the Muslim youth at that festival, there is a line that Mr Isreals speech does cross into inciting violence and becomes akin to shouting fire in a crowded movie theater, thus it could be argued that his presence at this festival is created a public disturbance and a detriment to the safety of every one around, thus it could be argued that his speech is not protected by the first amendment

 

[Dogma's Demise]

Can you please pin point the exact moment or act or whatever when, in your opinion, that line was crossed?

 

[IBSpify]

Can you please pin point the exact moment or act or whatever when, in your opinion, that line was crossed?

No, I can not, the video in which i have to go on here contains many cuts and edits, it also starts not when they arrive at the festival, but many minutes or hours into their arrival, thus it is impossible to tell what they did or said to provoke such a reaction. I personally find it very hard to believe that a group of people carrying signs and not saying anything (as the Preacher claimed to the police officers) would cause this sort of disturbance.

However the preachers attitude when speaking to the police officers is such that it is clear that this was the sort of reaction that he was attempting to evoke. And again, when your speech is intended to cause a volatile reaction, and endangers and endangers the safety of the people around you, then it is not protected by the first amendment.

 

[Dogma's Demise]

You know, the WBC is even more extreme than Ruben Israel's gang, they once got sued for protesting near a funeral and ultimately the lawsuit failed.

Maybe it shouldn't be allowed when it comes to funerals, since it's a very special situation and it's borderline harassment of the family, but this is just some random public gathering.

I personally find it very hard to believe that a group of people carrying signs and not saying anything (as the Preacher claimed to the police officers) would cause this sort of disturbance.

I don't find it hard to believe given that some other past events have caused angry responses before.

(Not to say it's exclusive to Muslims or even to theists, but you know which religious group tends to be more sensitive to this.)

 

[Prolescum]

I really must rectify the missing entry for Muslim Tourettes in Urban Dictionary.