TFL posted an off topic post in his debate thread. I have moved that post to here. Consider this post to be his
Hi Inferno (and others),
Thanks for your post. I'm working on a reply, but am extremely busy with university duties and also some legal work (the judge gave his final verdict in the 1st case this week & it looks like we won ~$40,000 which will be a BIG help, but we need to do some paperwork and meetings quickly related to that). I apologize very much for the delay in answering.
While you're waiting, since you said you were interested in the topic of morality, you might be interested to read from these 2 short essays and especially the book by atheists/humanists. These of course are NOT my argument, but I will cite a bit from them but also many others when we deal with that topic more (I think once we get past the evidence and definitions, if you wish, you can choose the first topic that you want to discuss.)
1) An Atheist Defends Christianity
http://the-classic-liberal.com/atheist-defense-christianity/
2) As an atheist, I truly believe Africa needs God | Matthew Parris
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/matthew_parris/article5400568.ece
or here http://www.sustainlane.com/reviews/as-an-atheist-i-truly-believe-africa-needs-god-by-matthew-parris/USY41P9LLOW98XCS7MWVJJSVMO3A
3) Dr. Guenter Lewy professor emeritus of the Univ. of Massachusetts, a relativist and secular humanist decided to write a book refuting the idea that skepticism has contributed to the moral decline of the United States titled "Why America Doesn't Need Religion". He set out to ridicule the claims of Christians that the crisis of the age is a crisis of unbelief and to prove the attack on secular modernity "to be a danger to individual liberty as well as an affront to people of goodwill who happened to be agnostics or atheists." After doing much research and reviewing many statistical studies showing the crucial importance of religion for society, he abandoned his original goal and changed the title of his book to: "Why America Needs Religion".
"The fifth chapter, "Religiousness and Moral Conduct: Are Believing Christians Different?," begs the question of whether the Christian faith transforms the lives of those who take their religion seriously. In particular, Professor Lewy examines the questions of juvenile delinquency, adult crime, prejudice and intolerance, single parenting, and divorce, and concludes that the vast majority of social science research supports the finding that the minority of Christians who take their religion seriously (as opposed to the nominal Christians of the Christmas-and-Easter variety) have significantly lower rates of moral failure and social ills than any other groups studied.
You can read much of this chapter and book online. Start on about page 95 here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KfxJA_7zG7MC&pg=PA89&dq=Why+America+needs+God&hl=en&ei=tD5LTp2iMo_JmAXXqo3jBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false (note that the concept of people burning eternally in hell that is mentioned in this chapter as a Christian belief is one of the most revolting, vile, reprehensible, demonic, malignant, unbiblical and satanic straw man doctrines ever accepted by Christians or invented by people. You can go to http://www.helltruth.com for an overview of why it is not biblical at all. But, the book has many other good points and much solid research that is valuable.)
Until I can finish my posts on evidence and definitions (the definitions part is pretty much done) and a bit of a reply to your last post, all the best!
Bryan
Hi Inferno (and others),
Thanks for your post. I'm working on a reply, but am extremely busy with university duties and also some legal work (the judge gave his final verdict in the 1st case this week & it looks like we won ~$40,000 which will be a BIG help, but we need to do some paperwork and meetings quickly related to that). I apologize very much for the delay in answering.
While you're waiting, since you said you were interested in the topic of morality, you might be interested to read from these 2 short essays and especially the book by atheists/humanists. These of course are NOT my argument, but I will cite a bit from them but also many others when we deal with that topic more (I think once we get past the evidence and definitions, if you wish, you can choose the first topic that you want to discuss.)
1) An Atheist Defends Christianity
http://the-classic-liberal.com/atheist-defense-christianity/
2) As an atheist, I truly believe Africa needs God | Matthew Parris
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/matthew_parris/article5400568.ece
or here http://www.sustainlane.com/reviews/as-an-atheist-i-truly-believe-africa-needs-god-by-matthew-parris/USY41P9LLOW98XCS7MWVJJSVMO3A
3) Dr. Guenter Lewy professor emeritus of the Univ. of Massachusetts, a relativist and secular humanist decided to write a book refuting the idea that skepticism has contributed to the moral decline of the United States titled "Why America Doesn't Need Religion". He set out to ridicule the claims of Christians that the crisis of the age is a crisis of unbelief and to prove the attack on secular modernity "to be a danger to individual liberty as well as an affront to people of goodwill who happened to be agnostics or atheists." After doing much research and reviewing many statistical studies showing the crucial importance of religion for society, he abandoned his original goal and changed the title of his book to: "Why America Needs Religion".
"The fifth chapter, "Religiousness and Moral Conduct: Are Believing Christians Different?," begs the question of whether the Christian faith transforms the lives of those who take their religion seriously. In particular, Professor Lewy examines the questions of juvenile delinquency, adult crime, prejudice and intolerance, single parenting, and divorce, and concludes that the vast majority of social science research supports the finding that the minority of Christians who take their religion seriously (as opposed to the nominal Christians of the Christmas-and-Easter variety) have significantly lower rates of moral failure and social ills than any other groups studied.
You can read much of this chapter and book online. Start on about page 95 here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=KfxJA_7zG7MC&pg=PA89&dq=Why+America+needs+God&hl=en&ei=tD5LTp2iMo_JmAXXqo3jBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false (note that the concept of people burning eternally in hell that is mentioned in this chapter as a Christian belief is one of the most revolting, vile, reprehensible, demonic, malignant, unbiblical and satanic straw man doctrines ever accepted by Christians or invented by people. You can go to http://www.helltruth.com for an overview of why it is not biblical at all. But, the book has many other good points and much solid research that is valuable.)
Until I can finish my posts on evidence and definitions (the definitions part is pretty much done) and a bit of a reply to your last post, all the best!
Bryan
