bluejatheist
New Member
The easily depressed may hit the road...
(Edited a bit to improve questions)
This is an interesting subject, I'd like to see what LOR has to say on suicide. Here are some questions to chew on and discuss; I'll answer them myself later. Some are actually multiple questions grouped together. Some notable cases of suicide are present at the bottom of this post, if the questions presented are too vague, feel free to answer them in terms of one of the cases, or of the case of another person of your choosing.
Enjoy;
"Criticism" in this context I mean as, the primary objections you have to suicide.
In the context of this thread, "Suicide" is meant as: Causing one's own solitary death, intentionally by some sort of means for some reason other than being compelled by an outside pressure. Does not include things such as suicide bombing, murder suicide, or forced suicide. One person dies - the person committing suicide - and they do so by their own hand, without outside force. Includes suicide due to mental illness and otherwise.
1: If someone commits suicide how would you view them morally, logically, culturally and religiously(if applicable)?
If it depends on their situation, please explain.
2: Should attempted(but failed) suicide have legal consequences? Is there any logic in being charged with the crime of 'attempted murder of yourself?' Is attempting suicide a right, as it is your life and your body?
3: Do you think suicide could possibly be considered a 'sound of mind, conscious' choice(Barring situations where suicide is an alternative to 'worse' fates i.e. 9/11 jumpers, and forced suicide i.e. Irwin Rommel), or is the serious consideration of it a sign of lack of soundness of mind? Is it possible to be mentally healthy but also willing to end one's own life?
4: Presuming that an individual, having made arrangements to minimize the financial consequences of their death on others, with no dependents to suffer directly from the loss, commits suicide, would you find any reason why they should be criticized, if it was their choice and had no affect on you or direct consequences on others?
5: Does anyone have any business criticizing or pitying someone for their lack of value for their life? Can it be argued that a preference to live over dying is universal, or subjective and depending on the individual? If someone simply does not want to live, and is in some way found to be without disorder such as depression, do they have a right to end their life, or should they be denied this option and undergo rehabilitation? Does being born into this life obligate you to live it to natural* death?
6: If one primary reason for any criticism is the emotional loss inflicted on family**, what if there was no family connection to be harmed?
7: (For religious members) What is your religion's view of suicide? Are the consequences of suicide under your religion fair, in your view?
*: By natural, I mean through the natural course of life and it's events, whatever they might be; all causes of death BUT intentionally self inflicted
**: Family may be taken to included all those close- Parents, siblings, children, extended family, friends, loved ones in general.
_______________________________
Some historical cases to look into when considering questions, the biographies are brief, please refer to links for more complete information.
Kevin Carter::
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Carter
http://www.africansuccess.org/visuFiche.php?id=1029&lang=en
A war photographer in post-apartheid South Africa. Witness to countless cases of cruelty in warfare, and member of the Bang-Bang Club. Noted for his controversial photograph of an african child collapsed and starving with a scavenger bird lurking in the distance. Committed suicide via car exhaust and a hose. His rationale is recorded as such:
Alan Turing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Turing
Renown computer scientist, provided important service for the United Kingdom during World War II. Convicted of crimes for homosexual acts with the options of either a prison sentence or chemical castration. Likely committed suicide via cyanide in an apple. It is suspected he used such a method to allow his mother reasonable doubt that his death was an accident.
Kurt Cobain:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_cobain
American singer, member of the band Nirvana. Though subject to some controversy, he likely committed suicide via firearm after dealing with depression, addiction and other issues for some time. He had dependents at the time.
(Edited a bit to improve questions)
This is an interesting subject, I'd like to see what LOR has to say on suicide. Here are some questions to chew on and discuss; I'll answer them myself later. Some are actually multiple questions grouped together. Some notable cases of suicide are present at the bottom of this post, if the questions presented are too vague, feel free to answer them in terms of one of the cases, or of the case of another person of your choosing.
Enjoy;
"Criticism" in this context I mean as, the primary objections you have to suicide.
In the context of this thread, "Suicide" is meant as: Causing one's own solitary death, intentionally by some sort of means for some reason other than being compelled by an outside pressure. Does not include things such as suicide bombing, murder suicide, or forced suicide. One person dies - the person committing suicide - and they do so by their own hand, without outside force. Includes suicide due to mental illness and otherwise.
1: If someone commits suicide how would you view them morally, logically, culturally and religiously(if applicable)?
If it depends on their situation, please explain.
2: Should attempted(but failed) suicide have legal consequences? Is there any logic in being charged with the crime of 'attempted murder of yourself?' Is attempting suicide a right, as it is your life and your body?
3: Do you think suicide could possibly be considered a 'sound of mind, conscious' choice(Barring situations where suicide is an alternative to 'worse' fates i.e. 9/11 jumpers, and forced suicide i.e. Irwin Rommel), or is the serious consideration of it a sign of lack of soundness of mind? Is it possible to be mentally healthy but also willing to end one's own life?
4: Presuming that an individual, having made arrangements to minimize the financial consequences of their death on others, with no dependents to suffer directly from the loss, commits suicide, would you find any reason why they should be criticized, if it was their choice and had no affect on you or direct consequences on others?
5: Does anyone have any business criticizing or pitying someone for their lack of value for their life? Can it be argued that a preference to live over dying is universal, or subjective and depending on the individual? If someone simply does not want to live, and is in some way found to be without disorder such as depression, do they have a right to end their life, or should they be denied this option and undergo rehabilitation? Does being born into this life obligate you to live it to natural* death?
6: If one primary reason for any criticism is the emotional loss inflicted on family**, what if there was no family connection to be harmed?
7: (For religious members) What is your religion's view of suicide? Are the consequences of suicide under your religion fair, in your view?
*: By natural, I mean through the natural course of life and it's events, whatever they might be; all causes of death BUT intentionally self inflicted
**: Family may be taken to included all those close- Parents, siblings, children, extended family, friends, loved ones in general.
_______________________________
Some historical cases to look into when considering questions, the biographies are brief, please refer to links for more complete information.
Kevin Carter::
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Carter
http://www.africansuccess.org/visuFiche.php?id=1029&lang=en
A war photographer in post-apartheid South Africa. Witness to countless cases of cruelty in warfare, and member of the Bang-Bang Club. Noted for his controversial photograph of an african child collapsed and starving with a scavenger bird lurking in the distance. Committed suicide via car exhaust and a hose. His rationale is recorded as such:
Kevin Carter said:I am depressed ... without phone ... money for rent ... money for child support ... money for debts ... money!!! ... I am haunted by the vivid memories of killings and corpses and anger and pain ... of starving or wounded children, of trigger-happy madmen, often police, of killer executioners ... I have gone to join Ken [recently deceased colleague Ken Oosterbroek] if I am that lucky.
Alan Turing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Turing
Renown computer scientist, provided important service for the United Kingdom during World War II. Convicted of crimes for homosexual acts with the options of either a prison sentence or chemical castration. Likely committed suicide via cyanide in an apple. It is suspected he used such a method to allow his mother reasonable doubt that his death was an accident.
Kurt Cobain:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_cobain
American singer, member of the band Nirvana. Though subject to some controversy, he likely committed suicide via firearm after dealing with depression, addiction and other issues for some time. He had dependents at the time.