should victimless crimes even be illegal?

[ranchodeluxe]

once again being true to form i have chosen another controversial subject. it is my personal opinion that these crimes should probably not be illegal. i suspect some lor members will disagree here and this could get interesting.

here are some examples of victimless crimes:

Riding a motorcycle or bicycle without a helmet
BASE jumping from city buildings
Individual purchase and consumption of recreational drugs
Driving a motor vehicle without a seatbelt
Prostitution and/or soliciting for prostitution
Public nudity and fornication
Abortion
Unlicensed prizefights
Assisting someone to die at his or her request.

 

[Anachronous Rex]

BASE jumping from city buildings

I'm going to say no on this one. Though only because my insurance would probably make a huge hassle out of collecting for a body landing on my car.

 

[kenandkids]

#'s 1,2,4 involve others and society, that is why there are regulations. People have to clean up the blood and mess that results and society foots the bill. Public sex just isn't something we want on every streetcorner for many reasons.

 

[ranchodeluxe]

#'s 1,2,4 involve others and society, that is why there are regulations. People have to clean up the blood and mess that results and society foots the bill. Public sex just isn't something we want on every streetcorner for many reasons.

the risk of being in a fatal accident should be a deterrent enough to avoid #s 1,2,4. and if public nudity and sex were legal than i seriously doubt it would be seen on every street corner, my guess is that it would probably be rarely seen at all as most people are fairly modest about their bodies.

 

[kenandkids]

#'s 1,2,4 involve others and society, that is why there are regulations. People have to clean up the blood and mess that results and society foots the bill. Public sex just isn't something we want on every streetcorner for many reasons.

the risk of being in a fatal accident should be a deterrent enough to avoid #s 1,2,4. and if public nudity and sex were legal than i seriously doubt it would be seen on every street corner, my guess is that it would probably be rarely seen at all as most people are fairly modest about their bodies.

We have dozens of decades as proof that risk of fatality does not encourage safety in those exact circumstances... Perhaps if a caveat was that family members must clean up the mess and no rescue efforts would be wasted on the people who ignore the basic safety devices...

No, public sex is unacceptable, nudity not so much.

 

[ranchodeluxe]

public sex if legalized would still be so rare that it would be akin to seeing a unicorn. if i were driving down the street and witnessed public sex i might even be inclined to slow down and take a better look depending on if i liked what i saw or not. i dont think public sex would ruin anyones childhood any more than two dogs fucking in the road and would probably be no less disturbing than the images seen in sex education class. children are already exposed to more sex scenes from tv and the internet than parents are aware of. if what you see offends you than you can always just look away.

 

[kenandkids]

public sex if legalized would still be so rare that it would be akin to seeing a unicorn. if i were driving down the street and witnessed public sex i might even be inclined to slow down and take a better look depending on if i liked what i saw or not. i dont think public sex would ruin anyones childhood any more than two dogs fucking in the road and would probably be no less disturbing than the images seen in sex education class. children are already exposed to more sex scenes from tv and the internet than parents are aware of. if what you see offends you than you can always just look away.

1) You do realise that millions of people are exhibitionists and that unicorns don't exist...
2) Have you ever seen a sex ed vid? They aren't pornographic and rarely very accurate...
3) Your last sentence is the great defence of religious people everywhere, fuck that entire concept!

 

[ranchodeluxe]

public sex if legalized would still be so rare that it would be akin to seeing a unicorn. if i were driving down the street and witnessed public sex i might even be inclined to slow down and take a better look depending on if i liked what i saw or not. i dont think public sex would ruin anyones childhood any more than two dogs fucking in the road and would probably be no less disturbing than the images seen in sex education class. children are already exposed to more sex scenes from tv and the internet than parents are aware of. if what you see offends you than you can always just look away.

1) You do realise that millions of people are exhibitionists and that unicorns don't exist...
2) Have you ever seen a sex ed vid? They aren't pornographic and rarely very accurate...
3) Your last sentence is the great defence of religious people everywhere, fuck that entire concept!

1. can you prove unicorns do not exist?
2. why should people be ashamed of nudity and why exactly should public sex be illegal?
a christian will tell you its because of original sin. but what reason would an atheist give? why exactly is the act of humans having sex so indecent?
3. this defense is not just used by religious groups but groups that fight for free rights also.

 

[BrainBlow]

1. can you prove unicorns do not exist?
2. why should people be ashamed of nudity and why exactly should public sex be illegal?
a christian will tell you its because of original sin. but what reason would an atheist give? why exactly is the act of humans having sex so indecent?
3. this defense is not just used by religious groups but groups that fight for free rights also.

1. There is no evidence FOR their existence, so the default stance is that they do NOT. Simple as that.

2. Because I don't want two people humping on the seat in front of me at the train. I do not wish to be exposed to some hairy guy's naked blubbery ass while in a public sector. It simply has to do with comfort. Many people pick their noses in private, but not in public. Nose picking is natural and there is no religious law against it.
So why do people, even those who pick their noses themselves, not wish to see people pick their noses in public? Because it is gross. Simple as that. And public sex is plenty more gross in most cases than picking your nose.
And don't go imagining this when you think of public sex:

Because it will more often than not be more like this:

3. eh, what? No! It is the opposite! RIGHTS GROUPS are absolutely NOT the people who "look away" when they see something offending! If they did, THEY WOULDN'T BE A FREAKING RIGHTS GROUP!

 

[quantumfireball2099]

Driving a motor vehicle without a seatbelt

Depending on if you have passengers with you... Can you image a car crash with 4 people in the car? If you are not fastened in, you will be flailing about the inside of the car like a rag doll.. this could really hurt, or even kill, someone.

For instance, if you are the driver and you are fastened in, but the person directly behind you is not. If you get in a front side collision, they have the potential to smash into you...

 

[MRaverz]

#'s 1,2,4 involve others and society, that is why there are regulations. People have to clean up the blood and mess that results and society foots the bill. Public sex just isn't something we want on every streetcorner for many reasons.

I would argue that 3 and 6 also involve society and others.

 

[RestrictedAccess]

Abortion

I would argue that abortion isn't victimless, seeing as a living organism does die as a result.

As for the rest - assuming that the only potential victim is yourself, the punishment for those actions should be the results if things go wrong. In the case of city base jumping, if things do go wrong it has the potential to create a victim that isn't the jumper. Kind of like drunk driving - it's entirely possible to get from point A to point B while drunk driving, but the risks involved and the harm it COULD cause justify it's illegal status.

 

[ranchodeluxe]

after careful consideration i have come to the conclusion that public nudity and public sex can not be defended any more than public defecation can, but i would argue that woman should have the right to go topless in public at the very least.

 

[Prolescum]

Riding a motorcycle or bicycle without a helmet

Is it illegal to ride a bicycle without a helmet? It isn't in my country. Riding a motorbike without a helmet is both reckless and feckless. If you're considering it, you shouldn't be given a license.

BASE jumping from city buildings

As others have noted, it's a danger to the general public.

Individual purchase and consumption of recreational drugs

It isn't a black and white issue. Addiction to certain substances leads inexorably to other public concerns, i.e. crime. If you really think it is as simple as allowing individual purchase of recreational drugs, you need some education.

Driving a motor vehicle without a seatbelt

Already addressed adequately by others.

Prostitution and/or soliciting for prostitution

Hard to remove exploitation from the equation. Err on the side of caution until a nuanced approach can be found. Good luck with that one.

Public nudity and fornication

I, and I'm sure many others, have no desire to see your spotty arse bobbing around like an epileptic whale when I'm eating a falafel. If I want to see unkempt pubes and rolls of stomach, there's a nudist beach twenty five minutes from here.

Abortion

Not a crime here.

Unlicensed prizefights

Fewer fucking barbarians around? Sold.

Assisting someone to die at his or her request.

With appropriate checks and balances, I am in favour of euthanasia.

after careful consideration i have come to the conclusion that public nudity and public sex can not be defended any more than public defecation can, but i would argue that woman should have the right to go topless in public at the very least.

Go on then.

 

[lrkun]

once again being true to form i have chosen another controversial subject. it is my personal opinion that these crimes should probably not be illegal. i suspect some lor members will disagree here and this could get interesting.

here are some examples of victimless crimes:

Riding a motorcycle or bicycle without a helmet
BASE jumping from city buildings
Individual purchase and consumption of recreational drugs
Driving a motor vehicle without a seatbelt
Prostitution and/or soliciting for prostitution
Public nudity and fornication
Abortion
Unlicensed prizefights
Assisting someone to die at his or her request.

The lock here is: why are the above prohibited? an interesting lock, worth asking, is why not prohibit the above?

The key may be found by first defining what victimless crime stands for, why define it as such, who and to whom it applies, and the intended result.

 

[Nemesiah]

why topless? why not nude? what is offending? tank tops?, braless?, miniskirts? tatoos? its all subjective

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

Hmm...

 

[borrofburi]

Abortion

I would argue that abortion isn't victimless, seeing as a living organism does die as a result.

...So? I mass murder bacteria all the time, probably billions, if not trillions, of living organisms have died at (on) my hands...

 

[kenandkids]

...So? I mass murder bacteria all the time, probably billions, if not trillions, of living organisms have died at (on) my hands...

Not to mention all of the murder you do when eating, all the way from the tilling of a field, which kills most things in it, to picking/slaughtering and then on to cooking and preparing...

 

[ranchodeluxe]

:lol: nice post )O( Hytegia )O(