should people lie to there childern about santa?

[ImprobableJoe]

In my household we celebrate Christmas despite all being atheists. I was never quite sure why.

Presents, that's why... I don't understand why you would even ask!

Plus, well... I don't know about the rest of you, but I REALLY like hanging lights every year. I get a giant goddamned kick out of it.

 

[borrofburi]

Ciraric makes a good point...

If I'm going to raise a child in a world of logic and rational thinking, the last thing I want to do is tell him/her that fairytales are real.

The problem is, one of the best possible ways to FORCE them to think for themselves is to make them realize that even parents are sometimes wrong, as Skillbus pointed out. However I would say this is probably not the best way to go about it, I don't think I'll tell my children santa is real, I don't want them to learn that I'll purposefully lie, that is NOT why they should question me, they should question me because even with total honesty I am still fallible.

 

[ladiesman391]

If I'm going to raise a child in a world of logic and rational thinking, the last thing I want to do is tell him/her that fairytales are real.

Our imaginations help significantly when trying to visualise problems that will require critical thinking. I don't think we have be completely clinical in our approach to every little thing, our children may end up being very uptight and might struggle to fit in with others.

Plus, well... I don't know about the rest of you, but I REALLY like hanging lights every year. I get a giant goddamned kick out of it.

I have to admit I get a big kick out of driving round and seeing the displays people come up with, some of them are awesome!

 

[Q-Hack!]

I think its too late for my offspring... I informed them that when Santa comes down the chimney, I was going to shoot him for trespassing.

The wife didn't find it very funny.

The wife is Christian and she tried to keep the Santa thing going as long as she could, I always referred to Santa as a Fairy tail and as such I think the kids saw through it at a relatively early age. Nowadays when the wife says "What do you want Santa to bring you" They all understand that she is really asking what do they want from us.

Indecently, I don't recommend scaring your 5 year old with shooting Santa... it took my wife an hour to convince her that I wasn't really going to shoot him.

 

[Giliell]

I might be the most christmas-loving atheist in the world. Cookies, spiced hot wine (German speciality Glà¼hwein), gingerbread, christmas markets, candles, presents
And somewhere in between all of that there's Santa, although in Germany Santa Claus comes on December 5th or 6th, and he brings you small things, usually a special sweet bread, apples, oranges, nuts and the first biscuits.
Now, as a child I always knew it had to be grandma, I just never caught her
The fact that the nuts were those I'd collected myself with grandpa and the biscuits being the home-made ones I hadn't been allowed to touch the day before may have helped to make me realise pretty quickly that there was no magical being who brought stuff.
And Father Christmas doesn't come down the chimney in Germany either, so there wasn't much supernatural about him either, but I was still disappointed when I didn't get a horse when I was five.

Now, I won't really lie to my kids, but it's something that comes and goes. Not just with Santa, but with a lot of things. Kids simply have too little experience about the real world.
To my daughter (2), there's not much difference between a crocodile, a dinosaur and a unicorn. She's never seen a live-crocodile, she's seen models of dinosaurs and she has a plush-unicorn. She'll learn that one of them is a real animal, the other one was once, the third one never was and if scientists don't mess with chimearas never will be. But that's no reason not to introduce her to either of them until she can understand the ideas of "died out" or "mythological creature".
What I totally reject is threatening kids with Santa or the likes.
If I feel the need to threaten my kid, I do it with me. There's nothing as terrible as a bad-mooded mum :twisted:
I hate it if people tell their kids "wait until I tell daddy/mummy/gran/Santa" If you dislike what they're doing, tell them, don't be lily-livered!

 

[Ciraric]

Presents, that's why... I don't understand why you would even ask!

Well yes, presents were a big reason why I didn't complain but what I meant was I don't know why my parents wanted to celebrate it?

I honestly think it was just my mother carrying over things she did as a child.

 

[Giliell]

Well yes, presents were a big reason why I didn't complain but what I meant was I don't know why my parents wanted to celebrate it?

I honestly think it was just my mother carrying over things she did as a child.

There's another reason: I wouldn't want my child to feel "left out". We are "cultural christians" and in a not so secular world it's hard enough for a child of atheist parents sometimes. I know it is because I was one.

 

[Q-Hack!]

There's another reason: I wouldn't want my child to feel "left out". We are "cultural christians" and in a not so secular world it's hard enough for a child of atheist parents sometimes. I know it is because I was one.

That is actually a very good reason. I think I would find it difficult to have to explain to my kid that "you" don't get any presents because "I" don't believe in Christ. Nevermind that all the kids in the neighbourhood are out playing with their new toys.

One of the things that my wife does is make quilted fabric items (ornaments for the tree and other do-dads to give away, etc...) I think that even though my kids did receive a few store bought toys, it showed them that giving something hand made was better. When my daughter turned 10 she gave everybody an individualised cupcake for Christmas and then claimed it was from Santa. In my mind that was definitely a good thing.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Well yes, presents were a big reason why I didn't complain but what I meant was I don't know why my parents wanted to celebrate it?

I honestly think it was just my mother carrying over things she did as a child.

Do you think your parents don't like presents?

 

[CkVega]

I do remember being told that Santa was real, but pretty much worked out that it was bollocks by about 5 years old.
What did actually confuse me slightly, was being told not to tell other children that he wasn't real, it was around then I realised that something strange was afoot with the world (not that I had a real frame of reference or anything, I just remember feeling very strange being told to lie to other kids).

I suppose it could be a rite of passage or something, being able to find fault and disagree with something your parents have said.

 

[Ciraric]

There's another reason: I wouldn't want my child to feel "left out". We are "cultural christians" and in a not so secular world it's hard enough for a child of atheist parents sometimes. I know it is because I was one.

Well actually I'm an ethnic Jew living as a "cultural christian."

My friends always wondered why, as somebody that identifies as a Jew, I celebrate Christmas.

I put it down to my foreskin. It must instil a love of Santa.

 

[mnewf2002]

The Only reason I would bring my children up to beleive in santa...is to use it as a referance point for god........God is Santa for Adults

 

[Sloth]

Santa, the easter bunny, and the tooth fairy, were the bees knees when I was growing up.

If I ever have children, I won't take that away from them. Finding out Santa wasn't real didn't scar me for life. Childhood is supposed to be about imagination and wonder.

The holidays are some of my fondest memories.

 

[Lunar Sonata]

I would show my kids how magical the real world is before lying and teaching them about Santa

:idea:

 

[TonyBtheEG]

I don't feel they should "lie" about Santa, but inform them that it's just a story with good morals. Like Humpty Dumpty, the Three Little Pigs and the such.

 

[connorkimbro]

I believed in santa when I was young, and my parents played along, of course. I remember starting to figure it out when I was about four, I was really excited about it, I felt myeslf to be very clever for a four year old, and I would tell my parents... "Hey, look, I don't really think this whole santa thing is exactly true, is it?" (Of course, at four, I didn't talk like that, I'm paraphrasing)

And they would ask "Why do you think that?"

And I would point out my reasons for why I was skeptical. And they would say things like "That's nonsense, of course santa's real!"

At that point I got a bit annoyed, and I realized they we're lying to me about it... but it just made me more determined to prove them wrong. So I gathered a bit more evidence... "I SAW you eating the cookies Dad! You can't keep up this charade!"

And he laughed. And I KNEW then that I was right. And I felt *intensely* satisfied. I learned two things, then.
1) It is OK to question beliefs.
2) If feels fucking AWESOME to discover the truth of something and to KNOW it.


So in my case, I don't feel as if I was harmed by belief in Santa. I think if my parents hadn't encouraged belief in santa, I'd have had to learn those lessons another way.

My parents were very religious (christian), so It's sort of strange that they encouraged belief in santa, but NEVER belief in the easter bunny, because that was too sacred.

 

[Nightmare060]

There is a difference between using your imagination and pretending somthing is real, and believing that something that does not exist is real.

But these are little children your talking about here. They don't have a fully developed control over their emotions or a full sense of right and wrong as we do. So telling them about Santa and if they are good he brings preasents is a nice little fantasy that helps children learn to behave. Theres no "indoctrination" involved and it brings no harm to childrens minds in the future. Religon is a bigger thing because it has many rules, more complex belifes and rules than just beliving in a magic man who gives preasents at christmas if your good!

In a nutshell, letting little kids belive that Santa is real is compleatly harmless. So I see treating it as the same as teaching kids creationism as a big over-reaction.

 

[redlion7277]

My parents did make it seem like Santa was real for me. They would leave cookies by the fire place, write on the gifts that Santa gave it to me. Nothing special was made of it, just little things for a kid. But I do remember one year they didn't put out cookies and no gifts were signed from Santa. My parents didn't say anything and I didn't ask and I really didn't care, it was Christmas and I was happy anyway. After that I didn't think about Santa much. In the end I knew he wasn't real but it was fun when I was young.

It's not good for parents to lie to their kids for no reason, but it is a small lie that makes a kid happy for a time with a small fantasy. People do grow up and realize that it is a fantasy with no harm (usually) in the end.

 

[MRaverz]

Personally I think it's an excellent idea to tell your kids that Santa exists, therefore they will learn that you shouldn't believe everything you are told.

Simples.

 

[xman]

We've got a year and a half old boy and living in a predominantly xtian society one can hardly ignore it. What do the Jewish kids do? Or the Sikh? I'm pretty sure they get told straight up that Santa is a xtian myth. We're going to play Santa with our son, but the difference is that he will always know the truth of it. It'll just be a game we play with each other. I think that's better than learning that your parents tell lies. I'm sure we'll find better ways to instill critical thought. Ones that don't raise questions about trust.