Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the UK

[theyounghistorian77]

Using the backdrop of an Ann Widdecombe speech, Reverend Peter Mullen decided to come up with this in the daily Fail. I do have to say the rant he produced was a bit of a real laugh to read. Here are a "few" of the highlights:

"We are dominated by a secular elite which hates Islam every bit as much it hates Christianity. This elite of atheists and metro-political despisers is also a cowardly elite and dare not attack Islam ..."

"The Bishops and Synod ... are virtually unbelieving in any sense that St Augustine would have understood. For them, Christian doctrine is a sort of long-running metaphor for the social policies of the soft left. And their eschatology amounts only to a slavish acceptance of the pagan fantasy of global warming."

"Christianity now must be taught only as one among many religions. The only way this can be done is from the secular perspective. This is atheism by state decree."

"I do not resent this persecution. I welcome it. For it will weed out the pseudo-Christians, the wimpish bishops and the caved-in Synod. By persecution we discover who our true friends actually are. Persecution? Bring it on, I say. We will stand for what is good and right as Christian men knowing whose subjects we are. And if there should come the day when we are murdered by the unholy alliance between the Islamist terrorist and the secular commissar, then so be it. For 'the blood of the martyrs is the seed of the church.'"

Read the rest at your own expense :lol:

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

Doesn't the Queen appoint the Bishops?

Then, by default, is he not saying the queen is a Psuedo-Christian?

I'm not an expert in Britishology, nor a profound student of the C of E, but I'm pretty sure it's basically Catholicism with a paint-over that has the Queen as the head of the church and a few changes here and there so it looks somewhat different.

 

[Prolescum]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I'm not an expert in Britishology, nor a profound student of the C of E, but I'm pretty sure it's basically Catholicism with a paint-over that has the Queen as the head of the church and a few changes here and there so it looks somewhat different.

Pretty sure they're basically Catholic? Just... no. The C of E is Protestant with all the connotations that word implies. It's pretty rare to find rabid C of E members. In England, that is.

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I'm talking about structure.

Queen makes Bishops, doesn't she?

 

[nasher168]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

Yes, in theory. But I don't even think she has any choice over who gets to be a Bishop. She just does a little ceremony for whoever the Synod say they want to be a Bishop.
The Queen really is just a symbol in all but name.

EDIT: here's an explanation of it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Governor_of_the_Church_of_England

The Supreme Governor of the Church of England is a title held by the British monarchs which signifies their titular leadership over the Church of England. Even though the monarch's authority over the Church of England is not strong, the position is still very relevant to the church and is mostly observed in a symbolic capacity. The Supreme Governor formally appoints high-ranking members of the church on the advice of the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, who is in turn advised by church leaders.

When they say "advice" they really mean "orders". She could resist but in reality wouldn't.

 

[)O( Hytegia )O(]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I was just wondering about how a Christian can claim Persecution against Christianity in a country where the Established Church for the country is Christian and he belongs to it. :lol:

 

[Your Funny Uncle]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

What he's basically saying is "decline of privileged status = persecution." Pull the other one, Rev. It's got bells on.

 

[Squawk]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I love rants like that. They will be the demise of the idiocy that is religion far faster than anything I can do as an atheist.

 

[australopithecus]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

"Christianity now must be taught only as one among many religions. The only way this can be done is from the secular perspective. This is atheism by state decree."

Bollocks. I was taught exactly that in a Catholic school.

 

[Thomas Doubting]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

"Christianity now must be taught only as one among many religions. The only way this can be done is from the secular perspective. This is atheism by state decree."

Bollocks. I was taught exactly that in a Catholic school.

Wait what.. you were taught that Christianity is to be treated only as one of many religions.. in a Catholic school?
For some reason i hope i didn't get it wrong :lol:

 

[Dean]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I love rants like that. They will be the demise of the idiocy that is religion far faster than anything I can do as an atheist.

Perhaps the chap should take a history lesson, and find out what real Christian and Muslim Persecution is. Namely, in the case of Christians, the Persecution of the Christians by the Romans. And as for Muslim Persecution ... how about the persecution of Muslims by Christians during the Reconquista. Perhaps he has never heard of such things, and wouldn't that be interesting? :lol:

 

[Snufkin]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

The ratings of the comments on that article are exactly backwards. :cry:

 

[nasher168]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

The ratings of the comments on that article are exactly backwards. :cry:

It's what happens when you get a crowd of Daily Mail-reading bigots in the same place. :|

 

[theyounghistorian77]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I'm not an expert in Britishology, nor a profound student of the C of E, but I'm pretty sure it's basically Catholicism with a paint-over that has the Queen as the head of the church and a few changes here and there so it looks somewhat different.

Pretty sure they're basically Catholic? Just... no. The C of E is Protestant with all the connotations that word implies. It's pretty rare to find rabid C of E members. In England, that is.

My understanding, based on this (27:00 mins onwards) is that Henry VIII managed to retain some elements of Catholicism in seeking a sort of "middle way" between reformers who wanted a fuller blown protestantism and Rome oriented traditionalists when creating his Church, but you could say it's evolved to some extent in a more protestant direction since.

 

[Anachronous Rex]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

Used to be Episcopal (the C of E in the States), as I recall the services are essentially Catholic. The rest of the doctrine and dogma is essentially a truce between England's protestant and catholic denizens, hence the rather noncommittal stance on most issues and the "Book of Common Prayer."

 

[Prolescum]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I think we might be confusing Catholic with catholic a little; one is the name of the Roman church, one the word meaning "universal".

Certainly it's correct to say that some of the traditions were carried over due to the various factions of 16th/17th c. English wars (sans transubstantiation and other sundry stupid bits). I think it's fair to say that the Anglican Communion goes both ways (fnarr fnarr), but not the C of E itself.

That said, I believe some C of E priests and/or bishops are being allowed back (in some fashion) into the Catholic fold since the ordination of women as priests (and possibly then bishops) and the open discussion of homosexuality. I can't quite recall the details.

 

[Squawk]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

Wait what.. you were taught that Christianity is to be treated only as one of many religions.. in a Catholic school?
For some reason i hope i didn't get it wrong :lol:

To some extent thats the same for me. My Mum is an RE teacher in what was (changed a couple of years back) a catholic school. Although a devout catholic, she sorta taught religion in a secular way, covering all other faiths. Or should I say secular with a bit of bias thrown in. Other teachers were not nearly so good.

That said, I do occasionally see the stuff that she prepares for classes and it's impossible not to make comment every now and again. For example, the Einstein quote featured on one of her slides, and I couldn't let that appeal to authority pass.

 

[theyounghistorian77]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

I think we might be confusing Catholic with catholic a little; one is the name of the Roman church, one the word meaning "universal".

Certainly it's correct to say that some of the traditions were carried over due to the various factions of 16th/17th c. English wars (sans transubstantiation and other sundry stupid bits). I think it's fair to say that the Anglican Communion goes both ways (fnarr fnarr), but not the C of E itself.

That said, I believe some C of E priests and/or bishops are being allowed back (in some fashion) into the Catholic fold since the ordination of women as priests (and possibly then bishops) and the open discussion of homosexuality. I can't quite recall the details.

I think Rex is the better authority on this than i am :lol: . Also about this whole thing about "Christian doctrine" being "a sort of long-running metaphor for the social policies of the soft left.", well what exactly is Anti-Christian about that? Seeing as one can find St. John Chrysostom and St. Basil the Great quotes for example advocating social Justice and i suppose one can easily bring up "Progressive" quotes from the bible too. Maybe St Augustine who he brings up would have some interesting things to say about all this and this. But anyway i digress, and it matters little to me personally if Rowan Williams is a left winger or not. He's still a Christian!

Also, if Global Warming is "Pagan" like he makes it out to be, and seeing as Global Warming has been proven to be real by an independant study, what does this say about the pagan religion as opposed to his Christianity? :lol: :lol:

 

[Laurens]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

All those people who moan about how secularization persecutes their religion would probably cry out for a secular society if one of the many religions that they don't belong to gained any kind of political power and favour...

 

[nasher168]

Re: Reverend whinging about "Christian persecution" in the U

All those people who moan about how secularization persecutes their religion would probably cry out for a secular society if one of the many religions that they don't belong to gained any kind of political power and favour...

Never mind that, I think most would cry out for a secular society if even their own religions got too powerful. :|