Gnomesmusher
New Member
Prolescum you're clearly holding a grudge from our past disagreements since you had to resort to silly claims about me. Legendary huh? Anyway, sarcasm or not, Welsh presented an exaggerated viewpoint of Ken's (i.e. civil rights atrocities) in order to argue against it and ridicule it. That's a straw man.
And here's a perfect illustration of sarcasm being used as a straw man argument. I'd like to see you defend Kent Hovind.
http://www.kent-hovind.com/breakfast.htm
Clearly Hovind does not believe anyone eats rocks, he's being sarcastic but also misrepresenting the opponent's arguments.
And here's a perfect illustration of sarcasm being used as a straw man argument. I'd like to see you defend Kent Hovind.
http://www.kent-hovind.com/breakfast.htm
Probably Hovind's favourite rhetorical line is "..... came from a rock." This phrase has numerous permutations:
If you want to believe you came from a rock .......
If you are dumb enough to believe you came from a rock ....
If you think you came from a rock 4.6 billion years ago ....
At least I don't think I came from a rock.
For maximum effect the line is usually spoken drenched in sarcasm.
Hovind is creating a straw man argument regarding abiogenesis, that is, the conditions of the first replicating systems on Earth. Forget biochemistry, only geology existed 4.6 billion years ago, according to Hovind.
The first significant flaw with Hovind's rhetoric is that "rocks" are silicon (Si) based and life is hydrocarbon (H, C) based. Abiogenesis research is interested in carbon (gas or solid), hydrogen (gas), nitrogen (gas) and a motley collection of trace elements. None of these elements (excluding trace elements) is argued to have "came from a rock"
Hovind knows his rhetoric isn't an accurate reflection of his opponent's position. He will sometimes add phrases such as, "When you boil away all the fluff and feathers" or "If you condensed thirty pages of the textbook that is what they are saying." Hovind refuses to acknowledge the 'thirty pages' of 'fluff and feathers' (a) expose his misrepresentation, (b) illustrate why abiogenesis is perhaps hypothetically feasible.
However, the power of the phrase, "came from a rock" should never be underestimated. In the hands of a charismatic speaker such as Hovind this phrase can kill any science at 100 yards. I will illustrate the power of this rhetorical phrase by showing a hypothetical scenario in which Hovind would show an opponent "eats rocks for breakfast."
HOVIND: At least I don't eat rocks for breakfast!
OPPONENT: What? Who eats rocks for breakfast?
HOVIND: You do. I don't know why you can't see it or if you are deliberately lying.
OPPONENT: Nobody eats rocks for breakfast.
HOVIND: What are breakfast cereals made from?
OPPONENT: Wheat. Rice. Things like that.
HOVIND: And where do these come from?
OPPONENT: Wheat and rice plants.
HOVIND: Which grow in the soil, right?
OPPONENT: Yes
HOVIND: And soil is made from rocks, right?
OPPONENT: Yes, but ......
HOVIND: See, you eat rocks for breakfast.
OPPONENT: But there is more to it than that.
HOVIND: You can add all the fluff and feathers you like. Admit it, you eat rocks for breakfast.
Clearly Hovind does not believe anyone eats rocks, he's being sarcastic but also misrepresenting the opponent's arguments.