Libertarian Islands?

[televator]

Well, looks like the libertarian model will have free range on these islands and the world will watch. The founder of Paypal has sunk (pun not intended?) $1.25 million into this but I would think it's going to require much more than that. How will this anarchy play out? Will it ever be built to begin with? Discuss.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/silicon-valley-billionaire-funding-creation-artificial-libertarian-islands-140840896.html

I'll try to make this first post unbiased, but I feel like I'm witnessing the possibility of a real life "Rapture" from Bioshock.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Thiel is a parasite who has enjoyed all of the benefits of society, and is too much of a sociopath to be willing to pay back anything to the society he has buckled from his whole life. What a jackass!

 

[kenandkids]

I would like to see the selfish and lying libertarians sent to an island in the middle of nowhere.Maybe the experience might teach them that cooperation is necessary for a society. There must be laws, of course, that they not be allowed to engage in other nations markets or moneys, otherwise they'd just be doing the thieving that they enjoy so much...

 

[ImprobableJoe]

I would like to see the selfish and lying libertarians sent to an island in the middle of nowhere.Maybe the experience might teach them that cooperation is necessary for a society. There must be laws, of course, that they not be allowed to engage in other nations markets or moneys, otherwise they'd just be doing the thieving that they enjoy so much...

Well, no... they plan on siphoning resources and wealth from all of us, but pay a zero tax rate over on their island. All the benefits, none of the responsibilities. We're not talking about sticking a giant dome over the island... although maybe they should!

 

[IBSpify]

I honestly can't wait for them to try and fail on the global stage showing everybody that their system doesn't work

 

[ImprobableJoe]

I honestly can't wait for them to try and fail on the global stage showing everybody that their system doesn't work

How can that even fail? They aren't forming a nation, they are creating a resort island where they don't plan on tipping anyone, and would probably use slave labor from Asia or Africa.

 

[kenandkids]

Well, no... they plan on siphoning resources and wealth from all of us, but pay a zero tax rate over on their island. All the benefits, none of the responsibilities. We're not talking about sticking a giant dome over the island... although maybe they should!

Which is why they need to have Cuba-like restrictions placed on them. No playing in our markets or moneys. No owning or running businesses outside of their island. No commodity brokering and forcing up prices for everyone else. Any person who goes there will have the belongings, money, and businesses in their original country donated to the state.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Which is why they need to have Cuba-like restrictions placed on them. No playing in our markets or moneys. No owning or running businesses outside of their island. No commodity brokering and forcing up prices for everyone else. Any person who goes there will have the belongings, money, and businesses in their original country donated to the state.

That's sort of the point, isn't it? Libertarians build their fortunes on inheritances, on the sweat and labor of others, and the physical and intellectual infrastructure of society as a whole. They usually make most of their money by leeching money away from the real economy and people who actually work and create things and provide services. And then... and THEN! they pretend that they did it all on their own, with no help from anyone, and BTW they shouldn't have to pay taxes and fair wages to maintain and grow the system that they have been leeching off of their whole fucking lives.

 

[televator]

I wonder how long they can go before they start tossing mercs at their problems?

 

[impiku]

If this fails, it will only show that a society in its initial stage of development is fragile(I guess every premature society is "libertarian"). No laws? Most libertarians are for laws and state. The only branch of libertarians that will take this experiment seriously are the anarcho-capitalists and some disciples of Austrians since the Austrian school is the only economic school of thought that is compatible with anarchism, mainstream libertarians that are trained in Chicago School camp(friedmanites) will take this as a joke. But I doubt even anarcho-capitalists will take this seriously since consequences of market forces; polycentric law and private defense, the basic infrastructures will take a very long time to mature.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

Here's the reason why libertarianism is so stupid, BTW:

Have you ever seen a large building being constructed? A huge team of people design every aspect of the building. A bunch of earth-moving equipment comes in and digs a giant hole in the dirt. Workers climb in, build a framework and set things up for the foundation to be poured into. More machines and more workers show up, building the frame of the building, putting up scaffolding and bringing in bigger and taller cranes to add to the upper levels. Then people come in and put in the carpets and the windows and the walls and floors and ceilings. Other folks come in, lay down tarps and start painting everything. Other workers install the elevators and stairs, the wiring and the plumbing, phone and TV and internet lines, the bathrooms and the boiler and emergency generator in the basement. Other people start bringing in furniture and computers and phones and all the rest. At every step, inspectors come in, experts come in and fix whatever is done wrong. Landscapers come in and put down lawns and trees and flowers and prettify the outside. Finally, after years and millions of dollars and the work of countless tens of thousands of people, the building is completed. All the scrap is cleared away, all the workers and their tools and machines are gone. People move into the building and start working, and if you didn't know better you might think that the building has always been there.

Imagine now what a libertarian sees. He sees a completed building. He doesn't see the labor of tens of thousands of people. He assumes that the building has always existed, and that he could build one better. Build one without all the scaffolding, and support structures, all the tarps, all the inspectors and experts, never mind the removal of dirt and scrap and "wasted" parts that are part of the construction process. He sees the building as a Lego set, where the construction requires only the parts and people that are left in the building. He thinks he can build a better building for cheaper, because he can do without all those extras like scaffolding and construction workers, experts and designers and inspectors, painters and plumbers and all the rest.

They see society as the building. They ignore the fact that society is also the scaffolding and workers that allowed the building to be built.

 

[televator]

I'll just put this here...

 

[Master_Ghost_Knight]

I really hope they go head with this thing, so I can laugh at their face when it fails. Of course not allot of activty is to be expected in the first years since they are primed to make it work, but when that initial momentum is gone we are going to be in for a show.

 

[Gnomesmusher]

Here's the reason why libertarianism is so stupid, BTW: *snip*

Nice analogy. It reminds me of the instances when someone's life has been saved through the coordinated team work of many rescue workers only to have someone say "I'd like to thank God for saving my life!"

I also thought at first this island would just fail and implode in on itself but then you had me thinking when you pointed out that they'd just continue leeching off from the rest of us. But I do think that they'll get tired of it before they even start building. They can leech just fine from where they're at now.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

I also thought at first this island would just fail and implode in on itself but then you had me thinking when you pointed out that they'd just continue leeching off from the rest of us. But I do think that they'll get tired of it before they even start building. They can leech just fine from where they're at now.

It sounds most like they want to create the perfect tax shelter, and nothing more or less than that.

 

[televator]

That really is an interesting analogy Joe. Especially in light of the fact that we have people building an island in the middle of the ocean to get away from "regulations" (which they hate) which include.....building codes. :lol: Where does the metaphor begin, and reality stop?

 

[ImprobableJoe]

That really is an interesting analogy Joe. Especially in light of the fact that we have people building an island in the middle of the ocean to get away from "regulations" (which they hate) which include.....building codes. :lol: Where does the metaphor begin, and reality stop?

Well, they expect their own building codes to be up to snuff.. I'd love to see them sink into the sea.

 

[JTB]

Atlas shrugged or a communist paradise?

Ever listened to a libertarian and a communist? They use different words, but they describe the same fantasy.

 

[televator]

Well, they expect their own building codes to be up to snuff...

Up to snuff? There's no profit in that. Build it cheap and sell plots of it to the highest sucker...err...bidder. That's the Free market way. That's the way to perform your duty to the free market god. You'd be a good little capitalist. The other Ayn Rand Cultists might compromise this ideal for their own safety and demand strict codes. But I doubt they really can trust the ones building it all for them. After all it is all about me, I, and myself in such a system.

 

[impiku]

Derp Derp Herp Derp Herp Derp Derp