Diet Help...

[FCAAP_Dan]

I don't think he's trying to say protein shakes suck.

He's just saying don't start one of those weird diets.

Like protein shakes only. Or potatoes only. Or cabbage soup only. Or water only. You know, crazy diets.

 

[Giliell]

I don't think he's trying to say protein shakes suck.

He's just saying don't start one of those weird diets.

Like protein shakes only. Or potatoes only. Or cabbage soup only. Or water only. You know, crazy diets.

She, please, I insist on it.
But you summed it up pretty well.

The problem I have with protein shakes is that they are more heavily processed food. And unless you're really building up muscles, you don't need them. Of course you can lose weight on a protein shake diet, but can you also keep your lower weight once you stop doing it? Hardly, because you never learned to change your eating habbits and about good food.
So, if you just put on a few punds over christmas, no problem doing an proteinshake/cabbage/potato/what the heck-diet, but if you go for long time weigth reduction, they're no use.

Oh, some more general advice I found helpful:
Stay away from so called "fat/calorie-reduced" foods. Ever noticed that the States are not only the country with most obese people, but also with the highest number of those foods?
They are heavily processed and since they mostly tase like crap, you won't be satisfied. Best example is "low fat cheese" Tastes like rubber sheets, so you keep eating.
Eat real cheese, but less of it. Parmesan is naturally low in fat and very tasty.
And if there's one high calorie food you really like and find hard to keep away from, here's waht I usually do:
I don't have a sweet tooth, I have a set of sweet teeth. Choclate is my downfall. Crisps go rotten in my household, but choclate is gone faster than milk.
So, if I'm on a diet, I go to a quality choclaterie and buy some high quality, awfully expensive truffels. You wouldn't dream of munching them down like the cheap choclate.
So every evening I have one or two of those, celebrating them.
You can do that for most foods. Even if it's pizza, you can somply make it once a week yourself with fresh ingredients, home-made tomato sauce and all that jazz. It won't ruin your diet and keep you from craving until you storm a supermarket and buy some frozen stuff.

 

[FCAAP_Dan]

She, please, I insist on it.

Sorry, I just assume everyone on the internet is a man, especially if their avatar is a picture of a woman. LOL.

Oh, some more general advice I found helpful:
Stay away from so called "fat/calorie-reduced" foods. Ever noticed that the States are not only the country with most obese people, but also with the highest number of those foods?

Chicken or egg really. I mean we have a lot of those foods to market towards the large amount of fat people. I don't think they actually caused the obesity epidemic. I find a lot of them a tasty and filling alternative while cutting out a few calories. But I have pretty simple tastes when it comes to food. Like the other day I got the shells and cheese with 2% milk instead of the regular. Thirty less calories per serving!

But I do agree that home made stuff with fresh ingredients is going to be better. I just wouldn't completely dismiss all low calorie foods.

I think a lot of America's problem is our aversion to drinking water and preferring $5 energy drinks and sodas and it's very hard to walk anywhere in America. Since most of this country was built after the invention of the automobile we didn't design cities for walking. The closest gas station is 2.2 miles from my house, the closest grocery store is 3.3 miles. I walk at about 14 and a half minutes per mile....I'm not making an hour long walk to get a gallon of milk. It just keeps getting worse too, the city wants a new high school and where do they want to put it? Completely on the other side of town near the industrial park, which isn't very close to any neighborhoods. Not many kids will be able to walk or bike to school.

Another good trick for diet is to up the fiber intake. Either through high fiber foods or something like psyllium husk. It helps make you feel full and it helps keep things moving.

 

[borrofburi]

I mean we have a lot of those foods to market towards the large amount of fat people. I don't think they actually caused the obesity epidemic.

Caused? Probably not, but I am of the opinion they severely exacerbated it, and were probably one of the causes.

I find a lot of them a tasty and filling alternative while cutting out a few calories. But I have pretty simple tastes when it comes to food. Like the other day I got the shells and cheese with 2% milk instead of the regular. Thirty less calories per serving!

This is the calorie mantra I was warning about earlier in this thread: not all calories are equal. I don't know how to say it any clearer. Maybe this: sometimes 30 more calories is the right decision, especially if it's a choice between highly processes low-calorie food-like-substances or barely-processed food.

I think a lot of America's problem is our aversion to drinking water and preferring $5 energy drinks and sodas and it's very hard to walk anywhere in America.

While the absence of walking certainly does not help, I think it has more to do with the pervasiveness of fructose (and in general, sugar) in our diet, especially in soda (instead of drinking water).

Another good trick for diet is to up the fiber intake. Either through high fiber foods or something like psyllium husk. It helps make you feel full and it helps keep things moving.

Indeed, we American's tend to eat far too little fiber so for the average person, "eat more fiber" is good advice.

 

[Giliell]

Chicken or egg really. I mean we have a lot of those foods to market towards the large amount of fat people. I don't think they actually caused the obesity epidemic. I find a lot of them a tasty and filling alternative while cutting out a few calories. But I have pretty simple tastes when it comes to food. Like the other day I got the shells and cheese with 2% milk instead of the regular. Thirty less calories per serving!

Well, but it might actually achieve the opposite of what you intend.
Milk is an interesting example.
Here'san interesting study that show that kids who regularly drink whole milk have a lower BMI than kids who don't drink milk or skimmed milk.
The scientists don't have figuered out the reason yet, but here's my hypothesis, which might not be too far fetched since it is established that artificial sweeteners, which people take to eat less calories, actually make you eat more.

Our bodies have pretty good mechanisms for being hungry and being full. Problem is: we're pretty good at recognizing hunger, but pretty bad at recognizing full.
If our mouths taste "sweet", they expect sugar comming and set the processes into action that are to take care of it. Our bobies expect energy. Now, there's no energy comming, so the body demands it and you go on eating.
I suspect the milk-thing to work in a similar way: Whole milk has abou the same fat content as breastmilk, so the pattern hungry/full should be established. Out mouths taste milk and send the information "Fat is comming". As we don't get the fat, the body keeps demanding it. So you might end eating 1.5 servings of the 30 calories less variety than you would have with the original recipe.

Our mechanisms for recognizing hungry/full may be disturbed early on. Studies show that breast-fed babies tend to have a lower risk for obesity. Why? Is it something in the milk, or has it to do with the way they are fed? Breast-fed babies are fed "ad libitum", meaning they get when they signal they're hungry and they stop when they're full. very time consuming.
Bottle-feeding is easier: You give them a certain amount at a certain time, so you don't heed much whether they're hungry or full.

 

[FCAAP_Dan]

Caused? Probably not, but I am of the opinion they severely exacerbated it, and were probably one of the causes.

I agree, especially "low-fat" foods which actually just have a ton of sugar in them and MORE calories.

This is the calorie mantra I was warning about earlier in this thread: not all calories are equal. I don't know how to say it any clearer. Maybe this: sometimes 30 more calories is the right decision, especially if it's a choice between highly processes low-calorie food-like-substances or barely-processed food.

I agree that not all calories are equal and the body treats fats, proteins, and carbohydrates differently. A 2000 calorie diet of twinkees and a 2000 calorie diet of lean meats, fruits, and vegetables are drastically different. In these case the choice was between highly processed food and highly processed food. However, one has 8 less grams of fat (including 2g less saturated fat) and only 3 grams more of sugar and one more gram of protein. Less overall calories, barely more sugar, and a lot less fat.

 

[Niocan]

There's a really simple way to lose weight: Eat food as nature provides it.
That's it, you can eat as much as you want and you can forget about the useless notion of calories because like it's been pointed out they mean *nothing*.

If you want to take it further, or want a transitional period between eating better I'd recommend The Master Cleanse for at least 4-5 days, 10 is the target but Do what thou wilt. I don't recommend this as a way to lose the weight, you'll lose that when you eat natural foods, but it's a great way to 'reset' your mind/body appetite.

There are many suggestions so far for you, and I hope you find one that works If you'd like, listen to the first two sets of this playlist to get a simple overview of what you can change.

PS: In regards to protein sources mentioned here, I'd like to mention that Hemp seeds are far better then whey and soy. Don't worry, they (sadly) don't contain any THC... Though if you want, look into the connection between said molecule and it's effects on metabolism for a nice little surprise.

As always, take this information as you will.

 

[TheFearmonger]

If you want to take it further, or want a transitional period between eating better I'd recommend The Master Cleanse for at least 4-5 days, 10 is the target but Do what thou wilt. I don't recommend this as a way to lose the weight, you'll lose that when you eat natural foods, but it's a great way to 'reset' your mind/body appetite.
As always, take this information as you will.

:shock: NOOOOO!!!! NOOOOOO!!!! DON'T LISTEN!!!!
http://hubpages.com/hub/Master-Cleanse-Lemonade-Diet
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/559021/dangers_of_hollywoods_master_cleanse.html?cat=51
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18595886/

Bad idea. :!:

 

[Niocan]

Sigh, I'm on the cleanse as I type (day 6) and I can tell you there's nothing harmful about this, and I actually have more energy now then before. You can fall back onto the lack of "evidence" (Because clearly any first hand experience is wrong) if you want, but your fears are an illusion. If someone is worried about it, look up the nutritional effects of the individual ingredients and judge for yourself.

It's your body, it's never a good idea to stress it and you know it best.

 

[borrofburi]

If you want to take it further, or want a transitional period between eating better I'd recommend The Master Cleanse for at least 4-5 days, 10 is the target but Do what thou wilt. I don't recommend this as a way to lose the weight, you'll lose that when you eat natural foods, but it's a great way to 'reset' your mind/body appetite.

There are many suggestions so far for you, and I hope you find one that works If you'd like, listen to the first two sets of this playlist to get a simple overview of what you can change.

All of the above is fucking stupid (I've had a long day, so forgive me for my non-substantive post right now, not that I'm sure there could be a substantive response to something so vapid).

PS: In regards to protein sources mentioned here, I'd like to mention that Hemp seeds are far better then whey and soy. Don't worry, they (sadly) don't contain any THC...

If I recall correctly, hemp is illegal? Some forms of it are? I dunno, and I know nothing about the dietary effects of hemp, but I'd be careful about this advice, especially considering the source.

Sigh, I'm on the cleanse as I type (day 6) and I can tell you there's nothing harmful about this, and I actually have more energy now then before.

And as always, personal experience is not evidence as it is heavily subject to confirmation bias, and as always you think your personal experience is the ultimate judge of reality

 

[Niocan]

In the US it's illegal to grow industrial hemp, congrats on being the only first world nation not to grow hemp by the way, but it can be eaten/used in any products.

Please don't confuse it with the female bud of Cannabis cultivated for recreational and medicinal uses, as the industrially grown seeds don't contain any of the cannabinoids you people seem to fear so much. Look up, even on wikipedia, the nutritional value of the seeds and you'll see why I suggested it.

I'm not here to provoke attacks, so please don't vent mindlessly at me and look things up first.

 

[TheFearmonger]

if you want, but your fears are an illusion. If someone is worried about it, look up the nutritional effects of the individual ingredients and judge for yourself.
.

It's cayenne pepper, and spoonfuls of fiber. Just like tacos, mate.

 

[scalyblue]

First of all, juice is processed food. In order to get juice, you must process the food. The practice of removing the fiber from the water soluable sugars in the juice is the primary reason our society has so much obesity today! Not to mention that it has all of the other drawbacks of a vegetarian diet, forcing you to take nutritional suppliments to meet your vitamin needs while maintaining enough calories to function. NOT the way to go

Drinking juice and maple syrup lemonade is about as natural to the human diet as biblical law is. So natural you need to take laxitives to continue shitting regularly.

I can tell you that that diet will have you feeling like you have alot of energy, because you are giving yourself vitamin deficiencies as well as turning your alimentary canal into the hudson river. The lemonaide diet only has 800 calories a day, all carbohydrates. This will cause ketosis as well as completely fuck up your glycogen cycle, while causing damage to your liver and kidneys at the same time.

Asking a 400lb person to drink salt water is ludicrous, his blood pressure is probably already elevated, and you're going to increase his blood volume and do *MORE* damage to his kidneys? Idiot

Do you know what this diet is? It's a thinly veiled, assisted bullemia--only it's from both ends and it has a nice authoratative website showing you exactly how to do it.

I guarantee that you will lose weight if you adhere to that diet as written. I also guarantee that you will cause damage to your liver and your kidneys, as well as regain the weight the moment you start eating normal food again.

There is no such thing as a diet. If you have something called a diet, and it is not the way you are planning on eating for the rest of your life, it is worthless.

 

[Niocan]

-Nature provided you with the hands to rip open the lemon and extract the juice, this isn't anything like high temperature pasteurization or GMO foods here..
-As I clearly stated before, it's a *cleanse* not a diet.
-You'll lose weight on the cleanse but the real point, again clearly stated, was to use it as a segway into the better eating habits. Clean out the bad, bring in the good.
-The laxatives are to clean out what's been stored there for quite some time, as on a liquid-only 'diet' the digestive tract slows down and the entire point of this *cleanse* is to *clean you out*.
-It's only for 10 days, a reset of sorts, and fasting is nothing new at all to humans.
-The saltwater flush is sea salt, not table salt, and I'd love to see you compare the sodium amounts between this and most fast food meals..

Seriously, it's not helping at all that you distort what I say to such degrees here.

 

[Giliell]

-Nature provided you with the hands to rip open the lemon and extract the juice, this isn't anything like high temperature pasteurization or GMO foods here..

"Nature" provided Louis Pasteur with the intellect to figure out how to make food safe. "Nature" and "natural" isn't a good argument for anything. The naturla way of things is to die a premature, painful death.

-As I clearly stated before, it's a *cleanse* not a diet.

There's no such thing as a cleanse.
It's the same old bs "alternative healers" have been spreading for ages.

-You'll lose weight on the cleanse but the real point, again clearly stated, was to use it as a segway into the better eating habits. Clean out the bad, bring in the good.

How should that teach you better eating habbits?

-The laxatives are to clean out what's been stored there for quite some time, as on a liquid-only 'diet' the digestive tract slows down and the entire point of this *cleanse* is to *clean you out*.

If there was anything "stored" in the colon, how should slowing it down help tp remove it?

-It's only for 10 days, a reset of sorts, and fasting is nothing new at all to humans.

Neither are murder, rape, incest and torture. And your argument was?

-The saltwater flush is sea salt, not table salt, and I'd love to see you compare the sodium amounts between this and most fast food meals..

Idiot
Sorry for having to say that, but there's no other word.
Sea salt IS table salt, or at least can be. Sea salt has a bit more minerals than mined stone salt, but that's it.
But here about the amounts:

Seawater is water from a sea or ocean. On average, seawater in the world's oceans has a salinity of about 3.5%. This means that every kilogram (2.2lb), or every litre, of seawater has approximately 35 grams (1.2 oz) of dissolved salts (mostly, but not entirely, the ions of sodium chloride: Na+, Cl−).

If you ever acidentially swallowed a mouthful you'll know how much that is. If you don't vomit imediatly, you'll be horribly thirsty and would sell your grandma for a cup of water.

Oh, wait, and here's the recommended intake of salt:

In the United Kingdom the Scientific Advisory Committee on Nutrition (SACN) recommended in 2003 that, for a typical adult, the Reference Nutrient Intake is 4 g salt per day (1.6 g or 70 mmol sodium). However, average adult intake is two and a half times the Reference Nutrient Intake for sodium. SACN states, "The target salt intakes set for adults and children do not represent ideal or optimum consumption levels, but achievable population goals."[57] The Food Safety Authority of Ireland endorses the UK targets.[48]

Health Canada recommends an Adequate Intake (AI) and an Upper Limit (UL) in terms of sodium,[58] as does the Auckland District Health Board in New Zealand.[59].

The NHMRC in Australia was not able to define a recommended dietary intake (RDI). It defines an Adequate Intake (AI) for adults of 460-920 mg/day and an Upper Level of intake (UL) of 2300 mg/day.[60]

In the United States, the Food and Drug Administration itself does not make a recommendation,[61] but refers readers to Dietary Guidelines for Americans 2005. These suggest that US citizens should consume less than 2,300 mg of sodium (= 2.3 g sodium = 5.8 g salt) per day.[62]

Seriously, it's not helping at all that you distort what I say to such degrees here.

No need to do that, seriously

BTW, recommending people to use distilled water in their diet is dangerous. Distilled water (in large amounts) kills you due to a different osmotic pressure than normal water.

 

[scalyblue]

Yeah the concept of the body requiring cleansing is, well, shit. The body gets rid of toxins all the time, it doesn't need us to take special steps in order to that. The idea that there are special 'toxins' that need to be 'cleansed' through a special process is ludicrous.

As another poster said, sea salt is salt. There's nothing special or unique about it that would put it in such a different nutritional category than salt that it is worth getting--I mean when I cook I get kosher salt, but that's because of grain size, not chemical composition.. Nothing you say will make fasting for a week healthy. And yes, this 'cleanse' is just a fancy way to fast

 

[Niocan]

"Nature" provided Louis Pasteur with the intellect to figure out how to make food safe. "Nature" and "natural" isn't a good argument for anything. The naturla way of things is to die a premature, painful death.

I was referring to the comment about processed foods and how juicing them doesn't automatically put them in such a category while the other techniques certainly do.

There's no such thing as a cleanse.
It's the same old bs "alternative healers" have been spreading for ages.

Really? Because I call cleaning out the colon... a cleanse. :facepalm:

How should that teach you better eating habbits?

I said it'll reset the mind/body's habits, and it does so by cleaning out the questionable additives stored inside you and a by-product of fasting is to teach self control.

If there was anything "stored" in the colon, how should slowing it down help tp remove it?

That's the very reason why you need a laxative... :facepalm:

Neither are murder, rape, incest and torture. And your argument was?

My argument now is that you take things way too far out of context. In regards to fasting however, try to look more into it before denying it completely.

Idiot
Sorry for having to say that, but there's no other word.
Sea salt IS table salt, or at least can be. Sea salt has a bit more minerals than mined stone salt, but that's it.

Quiet right, but if someone is going to rely on salt as much as this cleanse does, you may as well make every little part that much more healthy for you. The trace minerals help give you energy as well, because this cleanse does lack vitamins but again this is only temporary..

If you ever acidentially swallowed a mouthful you'll know how much that is. If you don't vomit imediatly, you'll be horribly thirsty and would sell your grandma for a cup of water.

Why in the hell would someone accidentally swallow a mouthful of salt? I also didn't notice any huge increase for liquids but that may just be because it's the only thing I drink on this thing.

No need to do that, seriously

Quiet right, as it seems inherent to most people here..

BTW, recommending people to use distilled water in their diet is dangerous. Distilled water (in large amounts) kills you due to a different osmotic pressure than normal water.

Which is why it's always great to eat salty things at times, and I'd take the 'dangerous' pure water over whatever's in city tap water any day.

Look, I don't want any conflict here and we all just give him advise so he can better find the method that works for him.

 

[Niocan]

Yeah the concept of the body requiring cleansing is, well, shit. The body gets rid of toxins all the time, it doesn't need us to take special steps in order to that. The idea that there are special 'toxins' that need to be 'cleansed' through a special process is ludicrous.

Take a wild guess as to what organ is mainly responsible for the excretion of toxins *from the body*.. If said organ is full of stagnant crap do you think it can do the best job that it can? No. All this is doing, is allowing your body to do its job that much better.

Don't be surprised that there's such a huge backup in most colons, I'm on day 7 now and there's still things in there trying to get out..

 

[borrofburi]

If said organ is full of stagnant crap

Except it's not stagnant.

 

[scalyblue]

Yeah the concept of the body requiring cleansing is, well, shit. The body gets rid of toxins all the time, it doesn't need us to take special steps in order to that. The idea that there are special 'toxins' that need to be 'cleansed' through a special process is ludicrous.

Take a wild guess as to what organ is mainly responsible for the excretion of toxins *from the body*.. If said organ is full of stagnant crap do you think it can do the best job that it can? No. All this is doing, is allowing your body to do its job that much better.

Don't be surprised that there's such a huge backup in most colons, I'm on day 7 now and there's still things in there trying to get out..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peristalsis

an idiot is you.

PS. I don't see you exfoliating your skin to free up your pores for excretion of toxins. I don't see you catheterizing your urethra and flushing your bladder out with saline. Everything or nothing or you're a hypocrite.

pps: the primary function of the colon is to reclaim water from your feces, not to flush toxins out. If that were the case, every case of constipation would be accompanied by TSS.

idiot. it's too easy to refute you, you know that? I'd say you were making up stupid shit on purpose