Can someone explain Jesus's sacrifice to me?

[Rivius]

I don't really get what's supposed to be so great about Jesus's sacrifice. I have heard chrisitians bring this up to no end. Now, if he's a supernatural being and there's an afterlife and he now pretty much sits on a throne....how is it a sacrifice? Infact, why did God have to sacrifice himself to himself? How was that a sacrifice to him? What did he really lose?
Yes, I understand that the crucifixion was terribly painful, but haven't others gone through worse? One of my delightful friends actually stated that no one would ever sacrifice themselves for someone they loved- and that only Jesus would do it. But aren't there countless historical figures who have done away with their own lives for the lives of many (I need examples but I'm sure there's plenty).

This has always been something that I never ever got.

 

[Squagnut]

First off, it's all nonsense to me too.

I suspect that the important thing is he died for our sins, not the manner of his death. Basically, this means that you are not responsible for your actions, since Jesus takes that responsibility for you. With all that ick to deal with, I think it's uncharitable of you to begrudge him a comfy chair.

 

[Rivius]

But people still go to hell? It seems to me that he just took it on for a couple days and then that was it? What exactly is this "ick" to a God? If it were done to a regular human, the level of mental strain would be unsurmountable. But he came out of it pretty fine. Sure, he didn't have to do it, but it seems a little silly for me to believe that God doesn't truly see himself a little responsible for our falling? I can't pretend that it was all charity. And nevertheless it was hardly anything to him anyway.

It's sort of like Bill Gates giving a bum a dollar and expecting an award for it.

 

[Squagnut]

Clearly you're underestimating the significance and importance of what Jesus did for you. An underestimation of such enormous magnitutde is the one thing for which you are held culpable. You'll be pleased to learn that the gates of hell have been refurbished recently - they've replaced the grumpy old Abandon Hope All Ye Who Enter Here sign with a swishy new Sorry Is The Hardest Word To Say sign.

 

[theatheistguy]

It's sort of like Bill Gates giving a bum a dollar and expecting an award for it.

Actually it's more like Bill Gates giving a bum a dollar, knowing that he'll get an infinite amount in return.

My explanation of the cruxifiction. An omnipotent and omniscient God made rules that he couldn't break so he had to send himself to be sacrificed to himself, to pay himself the fine (his own blood) that we're all racking up by sinning. This is considered a sacrifice because he was tortured for a day, went to hell for three and then became a worshipped god forever! I'd do it!

 

[monitoradiation]

What I find morally repulsive is that jesus never asked me whether or not I accept his charitable donation of blood to wash off my sins. First off, I don't buy into the sin con game anyway. God couldn't make us perfect enough not to sin? And how can the sins of ancestors be carried by descendents? The whole thing is repugnant to its core. Lastly, why does god need a sacrifice anyway? What, he couldn't just pardon us? He needs a sacrifice in the form of himself to himself, in order to forgive? What kind of sick joke is that, anyway?

 

[JacobEvans]

I think we are ignoring the whole bullshit aspect of the whole Jesus 'thing'

 

[theatheistguy]

I think we are ignoring the whole bullshit aspect of the whole Jesus 'thing'

true

 

[ImprobableJoe]

The Jesus story is fractal bullshit: equally bullshit at every level of magnification, from every angle. It doesn't make sense as fiction, it doesn't hold up as history, the story doesn't work from a theological standpoint when seen in the broader context of the Bible, it is logically and ethically bankrupt...

They call it the "greatest story ever told." In reality, it is a giant load of fail, that has only spread and gained power through violence and coercion. No one reading that nonsense without the cultural influence would even consider it to be internally consistent or particularly interesting.

 

[JacobEvans]

The Jesus story is fractal bullshit

IJoe, I think we finally found something in which I have no arguments with you what so ever.

 

[Jams79]

If God consigned his own son to eternal damnation then I might be more inclined to accept it as a sacrifice, as the Jesus story stands it was hardly a losing situation for God - Jesus came down preached a bit and then went home to heaven - that's not a sacrifice it's a fishing trip.

Oh yeah and I'm new to the forum so hi to everyone.

 

[Otokogoroshi]

Him dying put a crimp in the plans on making him the messiah so they had to make up bullshit about him coming back from the dead.

 

[buzzausa]

Whats' so hard to understand?

God sent himself to be sacrificed to himself in order to save mankind from eternal damnation in a place which he (god ) created because he loves mankind so much.

Really....it's not that hard to grasp.....IF YOU'RE TOTALLY NUTS!


And what kind of sacrifice is it really to stay dead for three days and then arise to be the ruler of the universe???

 

[Squagnut]

Well, with attitudes like these, I bet Jesus is wondering why he even bothered.

 

[ImprobableJoe]

IJoe, I think we finally found something in which I have no arguments with you what so ever.

So you decided to be completely right, the way I am all the time? Sweet, keep it up! :lol:

 

[theatheistguy]

Well, with attitudes like these, I bet Jesus is wondering why he even bothered.

Not like I asked him to do anything, if I hadn't ever existed I wouldn't have had a complaint. It's like me taking your car in the middle of the night, fixing it and then asking to be paid.

 

[GoodKat]

Not like I asked him to do anything, if I hadn't ever existed I wouldn't have had a complaint. It's like me taking your car in the middle of the night, fixing it and then asking to be paid.

And threatening to shoot them if they don't.

 

[e2iPi]

And threatening to shoot them if they don't.

When there was really nothing wrong with it in the first place.

e2iPi

 

[Squagnut]

I'd have more respect for Jesus if he only thought he was the son of god. If you know you're the son of god because, like, you're the son of god then being crucified may be uncomfortable for a while but it's not much of a gamble. Far better if Jesus had been operating on the same faith as his followers.

But speculating about that is nothing compared to pondering what could have happened if he hadn't been killed. As Theatheistguy says, it's not like we asked for Jesus to die, but without his death, Christianity doesn't have much of a story - ok, so he healed some folk, did some hey presto! and got a bit political, but the tale hinges on Jesus kicking the bucket. Since people in Biblical times had a lifespan of many centuries, Jeez would probly still be around today - but in absentia, we can make up any old bullshit about him.

 

[atheismforthewin]

\ One of my delightful friends actually stated that no one would ever sacrifice themselves for someone they loved- and that only Jesus would do it.

It's not a sacrifice. A sacrifice is the intentional loss of a possession, materialistic or not, for something of less value. If it were for something of higher value, it would be a gain. It's the simple concept of profit. This shows one of two ideas. Jesus didn't value those he was saving, or he did it for his own selfish gain. The second may seem antagonistic, but when you analyze the objectivist ethics* the second is possible and relatively productive. (Note the 'relatively') It is the incorrectly evil persona of gain that the latter of Jesus' reasoning could be considered antagonistic. The former of his reasoning, though, is just plain rude.

*Ayn Rand-The Virtue of Selfishness, an awesome read.